FDNY*EMS What If's

[BushyFromOz]

FUNNY IT SEEMS THAT NO ONE ELSE HAS A PROBLEM WITH MY CAPS LOCK I TYPE LIKE THIS SO FELLOW MY MEMBERS CAN SEE IT MORE CLEARLY

- AS FOR THE WHOLE ALS vs. BLS SITUATION THOSE WERE QUESTIONS AND OPINIONS

- I DO TAKE YOUR STATEMENT THE WRONG WAY ITS OFFENSIVE AND ONLY THAT OF AND ASS WOULD SAY SUCH A THING.

- SO NEXT TIME YOU POST SOMETHING THAT A DEEP BREATH, THINK

Thank you for that highly intelligent contribution to this discussion **throws out a banana**

[somedic]

Im SO glad Im not the only ASS on here anymore?

[BushyFromOz]

Im SO glad Im not the only ASS on here anymore?

aww comon dude, its not all that bad :wink:

[somedic]

Bushy: No its all good in fact. I at least understand and try where possible to abide by the rules of this forum.

Somedic

[Richard B the EMT]

Children, behave, it is a reopened string that had no other entries for over a year.

[BushyFromOz]

Cripes!

October 10 2005!

Minus 10 to me for not reading the dates again.........

[Richard B the EMT]

Don't worry about it, Bushy, I had to look it up under "Mensa Medic" to reactivate the string.

[FormerEMSLT297]

O.K. Here is the problem with the 2 medic vs. 1 medic system.... NYC uses it for several reasons:

1. they have extensive standing orders for many different patient scenarios and many involve reading an EKG is it V-tach, SVT, A-FI, etc. Obviously if there's only 1 medic then no partner to bounce the strip off of.

2. there are many places in NYC, like subways, some buildings, etc, where you can't contact medical control (telemetry) and your on scene time is extended.

3. While one medic is getting a history, physical, and starting O2 and EKG and a line, the other can get on the phone with telemetry and start getting orders for meds if necessary.

The final reason is:

4. If there is ever a question about patient care and a review is done, they want to be able to say(or hear the medics say) both medics agreed on the treatment.

This is one of the reasons that for years Lieutenants and Captains did not ride the ambulance with regular medics. They didn't want to be put into the position of LT. so and so ordered me to give that drug but i didn't agree with it.

This being said, the problem is this. I worked full time in NYC*EMS (FDNY as well) and I also worked on Long Island. In NYC my partner was a MAC certified Medic, and on L.I. my partner was often an EMT or even just a driver.

Except for very few cases like codes or critical ALS patients that require multiple treatments all at once, there is no difference in the care provided. I can teach almost anyone to run through an I.V. for me, put EKG electrodes on a patient, etc.

And the bottom line for the union that is fighting this is this: NOWHERE is it documented that 2 medics on a bus improve the patients outcome.

When this issue came up 15-20 years ago and Danny B. was still treasurer of Local 2507 (for those true dinosaurs out there)

He even said we would have a hard time fighting it because of the lack of research studies.

and of course managements answer is what everyone already said, more medics for patients that need them,, if the patient is critical sent 2 ambulances and you'll have 2 medics.

I was just in NYC visiting several weeks ago and I heard that the push is again on to put LT's in PRU fly cars with EMT partners and letting them do ALS. Quite frankly as a former LT in that system, I can't see a problem with that except that when you need a boss for an RMA AMA or a standby they will probably be tied up on a job.

The sad thing is that some EMS supervisors think (or used to think) that when they get their bars (LT. Captain) they are no longer medics and they don't have to provide pt. care.

It will be interesting to see what happens.

My thoughts are my own and dont represent my agency or dept.

Former EMS Lieutenant, EMT, EMT-P, MAC Certified Medic, CRO, Dispatcher, blah blah blah

[Richard B the EMT]

Lt, those are exactly the stated reasons why the union fought the Mensa Medic concept for so many years. Now, apparently, they feel the system's needs, or the union's, have changed. I do know, even with her not being the CMO of FDNY EMS, Dr Giordano (former chief medical officer of the FDNY EMS, for anyone not from the FDNY or even the HHC EMS) is still vehemently against the Mensa Medics.

[Asysin2leads]

There union's big sticking point on Mensa Medics are these:

1. You increase both the responsibility of the medics and the EMTs without an increase in pay.

2. There are several ways of getting more ALS ambulances to more ALS calls without the Mensa medic program. Improving the goddawful scripted protocol dispatch system would be the first step.

3. Less overtime for paramedics.

4. The logical step after one paramedic/one EMT team is 1 paramedic/firefighter and 4 CFR's.

I'm not so much against the program, actually, there are many times where I wish I was working by myself. But the fact remains is that they are doing this for monetary reasons, not for patient benefit.