VentMedic Posted October 20, 2008 Author Share Posted October 20, 2008 And that is the what it is really all about. You and the others can't stand that an inferior "fire monkey" is in charge and the superior paramedic is not. The only issue I have ever had is when paramedics get so busy and focused on doing doctor stuff that they forget that sometimes the best stuff is the basics and a rapid transport - especially with trauma patients. Of coarse I really don't know that because I am a fire monkey, but Barry told me that would be a good thing to say. LOL. Have you noticed that you are the one using the term "fire monkey". Not very many others including myself have ever used it in their posts. You are now offending FFs as well as Paramedics. Let me repeat my statement from earlier to you: In your part of the country, fire based EMS may be a spawn of the devil. Here, fire based EMS is the norm. It has the best pay and the best benefits and therefore draws the most paramedics. The ones that are working at non fire based systems here are the ones that get fired from us or can't make the cut to begin with. Or maybe they didn't want to be a FF. Memphis is not the only city that has Fire-Based EMS. Why I have even heard about a couple in my area! :shock: I am sure that plenty of them were from non-fire based systems. If they had it so good, I wonder why they left? When you mentioned Hank's Ambulance earlier, I realized how out of touch you were with what is happening with the American Ambulance and EMS systems. I could go into the economics and reimbursement part of that but why bother with you and the professional EMS providers usually have a grasp on this. Because I am so retarded, what can you do as a paramedic that I cannot do as an EMT-IV? Priceless. Even if I wanted to do a little name calling directed at you or even your FFs, it would be difficult coming up with something you have not already called them or yourself. It is not your department that is being discussed so much as it is the EMS profession and the changes it is undergoing with each deviation from the goal of an educational standard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MemphisE34a Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 My reference to Hank's was a joke. I know absoultely nothing about them except that I saw one of their ambulances while driving through Birmingham some 20+ years ago. For some reason I have a hrad time imagining that they are an outstanding service. Seeing how you didn't answer my only question, the answer is that you as a paramedic can not do anything that cannot be done as an EMT or EMT-IV on about 95% of the calls that I make. The other 5% you can offer a few skills that probably won't make that much difference in the long run anyway. Really, what is the difference? Cardiac drugs, io needles, tracheal intibation, pain meds........is there anything else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p3medic Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 So, other than putting water on 99% of fires, there isn't much more you can do than lets say a gardener with a hose? If paramedics have so little to offer, why then are the taxpayers in Memphis to pay for 130 more medics? Why do you need paramedics on fire trucks if they make no difference? Hmmm....Makes me wonder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VentMedic Posted October 20, 2008 Author Share Posted October 20, 2008 My reference to Hank's was a joke. I know absoultely nothing about them except that I saw one of their ambulances while driving through Birmingham some 20+ years ago. For some reason I have a hrad time imagining that they are an outstanding service. You bash a service that you know nothing about but saw one of their ambulances when you were not even 15 y/o? Was it because it wasn't a big pretty fire truck? You can not always judge a book by its cover. You were probably just meant to be a FF (nothing wrong with that) and not a medical professional. Seeing how you didn't answer my only question, the answer is that you as a paramedic can not do anything that cannot be done as an EMT or EMT-IV on about 95% of the calls that I make. The other 5% you can offer a few skills that probably won't make that much difference in the long run anyway. Really, what is the difference? Cardiac drugs, io needles, tracheal intibation, pain meds........is there anything else? Seriously? You don't understand the difference between EMT and Paramedic? You are in charge of Paramedics? Why are you even replying to this thread if you don't believe your department needs Paramedics? At least we may agree that an engine needs only FFs with an EMT-B or EMT-IV cert. This thread was not started with the intent to BASH Memphis FD but rather to discuss an educational concept that eventually affects a profession as a whole. You have done quite well all by yourself at bashing your own FFs, Paramedics and department. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MemphisE34a Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 I didn't say that it doesn't make a difference. What I am saying is it is not as big of an impact that some of you want to believe. Quite honestly you are correct, there is alot of hype in the ALS company concept. On a yearly report you will find that ALS skills that could not be done at the EMT-IV level might be done a handful of times on our busiest 1st responder companies. The basics will always come first- even with a paramedic on an ALS company - 99.9% of the time the ambulance will arrive before all of the basic or IV level stuff is done and with King airways, tracheal intibation is really not necessary. Debate quite honestly is becoming pointless. I am a democrat arguing policies in a froum of republicans - so to speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EMS49393 Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 I got to participate in my first code as an EMT nearly 15 years ago when I watched my partner (an intermediate) call medical control for orders while his patient was dying. As the doctor finally got to the radio and denied his request, the patient went into respiratory arrest. I remember vividly seeing him yell into the radio "thanks a lot doc, my patient just coded, finally I don't need your approval!" Maybe there is some talent in being an intermediate. You have to get a doctor to grant you orders before your patient crunks. You guys are right, no one needs us paramedics. They especially don't need paramedics that went to college. Someone has to keep the funeral homes in business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirduke Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 What? Paramedics aren't needed? Why the Hell didn't someone tell me before I spent two years in school..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig Posted October 21, 2008 Share Posted October 21, 2008 What? Paramedics aren't needed? Why the Hell didn't someone tell me before I spent two years in school..... Just a small piece of useless information for you paramedics here in NSW Australia are called "FROGS[/font:dce7871e54]" cause everything they touch "CROAKS" stay safe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBEMT Posted October 21, 2008 Share Posted October 21, 2008 In your part of the country, fire based EMS may be a spawn of the devil. Here, fire based EMS is the norm. It has the best pay and the best benefits and therefore draws the most paramedics. The ones that are working at non fire based systems here are the ones that get fired from us or can't make the cut to begin with. Just because you've monopolized EMS doesn't make you the better delivery model. Because I am so retarded, what can you do as a paramedic that I cannot do as an EMT-IV? If you honestly think this is a matter of skills, there's really no point in discussing the issue with you further. The fact that you think there's even a comparison is absurd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustdevil Posted October 21, 2008 Share Posted October 21, 2008 Here we go with this "ALS" "BLS" nonsense again. That's such a rookie concept. :roll: I know that to the fire service, EMS is just a first aid service to keep rookies busy until they've paid their dues and can go roll hose with the big boys. But in the world of the medical professional, we don't think in such terms. There's first aid, and there's medicine. Medicine is medicine. There is no ALS and BLS. It's just medicine. The inability of the fire service to pull out of that 1972 thinking is another factor that keeps them, well... in the 1970s. Is "ALS" overrated? Quite possibly. It is certainly not needed by a majority of our patients (unless you count all those "just because" IVs). So you have a valid point there, Memphis. No doubt about it. But ALS is not the same thing as Paramedics. Advanced "skills" are not the mark of a paramedic. Advanced education and knowledge is the mark of a paramedic. That knowledge allows him to perform a medical assessment of the patient that an EMT simply does not have the education or training to do. Because of that, only a paramedic is truly qualified to determine who does and does not need paramedic care. Regardless of whether an emergency patient needs an IV, airway, or drugs or not, they always need paramedic assessment to determine what their needs are. Besides, it really doesn't matter how rarely the so-called "ALS skills" are needed. The fact is, those few patients are the ones that the public, who pays our salaries, expect us to be able to take care of. If you can't properly and competently take care of those who need it most, then you FAIL at EMS. And if the routine runs are the only ones you are concerned with, there is a transfer jockey job with your name on it. [Not directed so much at you, Memphis, as at all those here who FAIL to understand the concept.] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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