Running Red Lights/ Stop Signs

[emTpromises]

For us, California state policy is 15 mph or less when breaking a traffic rule. Our company policy is COMPLETE STOP when breaking a traffic rule. Our district has red-light cameras at most of our intersections and if we go through the intersection at 1 mph+, the camera takes a picture and sends it to our company. This picture also documents how fast our vehicle was going through the red light.

Yes, it's a little Big Brother-ish, but honestly, what's more important, our on-scene time or whether we even arrive on scene? How can a smashed-up emt/medic help anyone? And on the way to the hospital, we often have patient's children/family with us. Who wants to be charged with involuntary manslaughter?

Again, if we come to a complete stop before running a red light, the camera will not even snap a picture. I feel that these stops are well worth the safety of our crews and patients. By the way, this is in an urban area--we don't have miles of road in which to see upcoming cars. And, even if we did, most of the cars in our way don't yield to ems vehicles. Why risk the 2-3 second eta on other people's stupidity?

[craig]

I could care less,as long as the lights are flashing and the siren is activated,I run like a raped ape! Red lights and stop signs don't mean shiit when seconds count.

Yes as others have said...i admire your honesty...

however what troubles me is that with an opinion like yours, i assume that you have the same care and wellbeing for those that you are charged to tend to as the same raped ape.

the raped ape don't care about anything but itself and by your feeble minded and neandethal comment, shows that you have the same high regard for your patient as well.

the biggest problem with your outlook on things is that younger and newer people that come to the ems field see this type of post and think "gee maybe that's how i should do it as well" and putting the good name of the field of expertise that i and many others work in, in question and shame.

My only hope is that some one doesn't get hurt or die due to the irresponsible actions of you speeding to or from a scene to save a "few seconds"

to paraphrase my sign off

PLEASE STAY SAFE

craig

[CodeBlueEMT]

I guess with age comes a little more common sense and an understanding of what is actually dangerous. Running lights and siren is dangerous. Running red lights and stop signs is insane.

There are too many tragic accidents involving EMS, fire, and police vehicles responding to calls. Lights and sirens won't make you a better driver. Other motorist are usually oblivious to anything outside of their vehicles.

I consider myself a professional driver. We like the term "professional". Most EMT's and firefighters consider themselves "professional" drivers too. The ability to go fast while running red lights and stop signs makes you a liability. At some point the luck will run out. I've had the shit scared out of me too many times. Riding on a fire truck that lifted the rear wheels off the ground going around a curve. A partner driving the ambulance so fast he couldn't stop at an intersection. Scary stuff.

My commute to work is almost 60 miles round trip. Traffic is aweful both ways. Being the professional driver I am, naturally, I'd haul ass. My mission was to pass all of the "Left Lane Louie's" and the oblivious nonprofessional drivers. I had to be making good time, right? Sitting at a red light (man, I wish I could run the damn things) here come the Louie's and the oblivious nonprofessionals I passed earlier. It's the classic turtle vs. hare race.

We're not immune to accidents. Even under the best conditions, shit happens. I don't want to be the one responsible for killing my partner, a patient, or an innocent oblivious nonprofessional motorist.

Shayne

[deastman]

I don't know the traffic laws in states other than my own, Michigan, but I have heard the same line all too often: "You don't have the right of way, you are asking for it". It's a cute little sentiment, but it isn't true, at least not in Michigan. Emergency vehicles displaying emergency lights and sounding sirens HAVE THE RIGHT OF WAY. Other vehicles are REQUIRED to pull to right, stop, and yield the right of way to the emergency vehicle. This is a ticketable offense, and in a past life as a police officer I have written more than one ticket for people who thought they could disregard an emergency vehicle. As for where you live, you are responsible for knowing the state and local traffic laws you operate under. Look them up, don't trust that the other guy knows what he's talking about.

All that having been said, the point of that oft repeated phrase is best expressed by another old saying; "You can be right, dead right." If you end up with a dead partner and/or a dead patient, being right won't bring them back. Just because you have the right of way doesn't mean you can safely exercise it. That is where training, experience, and more training come in. It is an area that is unfortunately too often overlooked. A combination of skill, training, and common sense will go a lot further toward patient and crew safety than all the laws ever written. The concept of "do no harm" extends to our driving. We have people's lives in our hands every day, and those include other drivers on the road. Approach your driving with the same dedication you approach your patient care, after all, isn't that what it is?

[Richard B the EMT]

Deastman wrote

I don't know the traffic laws in states other than my own, Michigan, but I have heard the same line all too often: "You don't have the right of way, you are asking for it". It's a cute little sentiment, but it isn't true, at least not in Michigan. Emergency vehicles displaying emergency lights and sounding sirens HAVE THE RIGHT OF WAY. Other vehicles are REQUIRED to pull to right, stop, and yield the right of way to the emergency vehicle. This is a ticketable offense, and in a past life as a police officer I have written more than one ticket for people who thought they could disregard an emergency vehicle. ... All that having been said, the point of that oft repeated phrase is best expressed by another old saying; "You can be right, dead right." If you end up with a dead partner and/or a dead patient, being right won't bring them back. Just because you have the right of way doesn't mean you can safely exercise it. .... A combination of skill, training, and common sense will go a lot further toward patient and crew safety than all the laws ever written. The concept of "do no harm" extends to our driving.

All right, I yield (pun unintended) the point that both Michigan, and my own New York State, have similar laws.

I note that deastman also mentions, "Just because you have the right of way doesn't mean you can safely exercise it." This follows my scenario of the distracted soccer mom.

You might have, legally, the right of way, by state or provence law, but until the other drivers realize that there IS an emergency vehicle at emergency status in back of them, or crossing their path, we should not accept it as a given fact. Other drivers first have to know they have reason to yield that right of way, before they can do so.

There is a law of physics that states 2 objects cannot occupy the same space at the same time. Don't be that emergency vehicle operator who tried to disprove that, as I hate attending Line Of Duty Death departmental funerals.

[Just Plain Ruff]

I'm still waiting on someone to say what a raped ape looks like.

[Stitch]

ok, it now thoroughly scares me that you're SOOOO interested in seeing that.... :shock:

[Don1977]

Well, what burns my ass is in Pittsburgh the cops throw the lights on just to go through the light and not want to wait til it changes. I guess teh donuts are fresh and ready.

[Lone Star]

As it's been said many times already, the lights and sirens are only a REQUEST for the right of way not a GUARANTEE of having the right of way.

This applies to ALL intersections, no questions, on 'if ands or buts' about it!

As has been said in this thread and many others like it, those that are in charge of operating an emergency vehicle must drive with 'due regard' for public safety. This means NOT flying down the road at speeds that are unsafe for the road conditions.

By the time you get dispatched, the 'emergency' is over, and if you cant get there in one piece or get there safely, you're going to be no good to the patient. In fact, the rescuer that needs rescuing is going to be of no service to anyone!

Furthermore, if you get into an accident while running 'hot', you're automatically at fault!

There is more to EMS, Fire, and Police duties than driving like a bat out of hell with lights flashing and sirens screaming all the way.

I've noticed an alarming trend lately, especially among the young people coming into this field. Educational levels are down, common sense is gone, and the permeating thought procss that 'the rules dont apply to me' .

It's high time we pull our heads out of our asses, go to the nearest washroom and remove the brown stain from above our collars!

[Scaramedic]

I'm still waiting on someone to say what a raped ape looks like.