flamingemt2011

To answer your question, it is because dumb emt/medics/FF/first responders started sharing thier photos on the web and to their friends, just google "emt shared crash pictures" or something like that. This resulted in many lawsuits or embarassing situations. So that is why the tool has pretty much been taken away. Is it useful, could be, especially if the patient looks unhurt, but the MOI can be shown in a picture. But doctors have been treating car crash victims for probably close to 90-100 years without it.

I knew u were drunk when you posted this last night, today you must be smoking something. How is that you think i am trying to protect corporations ????????? I am the one saying that you (the corporate medicine machine) should not be able to get away with killing patients, And you can not have a lawsuit if you bury all the information from the patient, they have no way of knowing, when you and the ER Doctor tell them it must have been a sudden heart attack that killed them, not the medication error.

Asysin, WHAT ETHICS ???????????????? No one has been willing to say how many errors their service has had, 99% of the services in here admitted that they will not report an error if it could get them sued, 99% of the respondents in this forum have stated they would not report an error to the patient under any circumstances, even when they killed the patient. Only a couple have outlined that their service has a PROCESS for dealing with errors, but they still never inform the patient. If we had ethics, errors (not identifying people by name) would be studied, statistics would be known by the whole department, and everyone would work together to eliminate errors. But when you bury and hide your errors, there is no opportunity to improve, so you keep repeating the error, and harming patients.

If you think revenue is not important for your service, go talk to your chief ? Rural Metro and AMR are both in all out 911 acquisition mode, and they are telling municipalities that they can do 911 for zero subsidy or low subsidy. If you think you have job security, you are sadly mistaken.

Well as usual, when you cant attack the message, attack the messenger. Can anyone explain how hiding and covering up that you killed the patient is the RIGHT thing to do ? ANYONE ? ANYONE ? ANYONE ? If you cant do that, then just hurl another insult against me, that is the adult thing to do

I didnt backtrack or change subject, I admitted I changed my stance after listening to everyone's opinion

I think there is too much hero worship among the newbies, it reminds me of the Porky's movie "So sayeth _______________, so sayeth the FLOCK". Just because someone has alot of experience does not mean they are GOD, they can be wrong. And I agree with Dwayne about the negative rankings that stay with you, regardless of what you say. I really don't care what my score is, but I would have hoped by now that you guys recognized that sometimes I take the whackiest opposing views just to make you explain/analyze your position. I imagine I am not the only one who does that from time to time.

Thanks dwayne, I say irregardless all of the time

Cant have it both ways, ever heard of the BRIDGE program for medics to go to RN, it is not a 4 year course ? But I agree with you that a new RN would have problems, as most new RNs have problems functioning in a hospital, but a few mandatory third rides would fix that. Get ready for it, they are coming, as hospitals continue to struggle in this economy, nursing wages will freeze or decrease.

Read on, unlike you, I can change my mind or be influenced by others. I changed my position to MAJOR mistakes only after discussing this topic with the forum, AND DONT EVER CALL ME CROTCHITY !!!

Yes, I was working a code last week when a fire monkeys phone blurted out, "I like big butts and I can not lie, other brothers can deny". Family was very offended

Again, try reading the thread instead of making up what you think was said. On more than one occasion I have stated this is about life threatening mistakes, not tylenol versus motrin.

Wow, so entrenched in defense mode you can not see the simplicity of the problem. I am discussing life and death here, not minor infractions of the law. I have in no way said or inferred that I am somehow perfect in all I say or do, conversely, I have shared how I am not perfect. As a matter of fact, I break one of my state laws everytime I make love to my man. But regardless of my moral failings or achievemnents, that has nothing to do with what is right or wrong in this scenario. You can shoot the messenger all you want, but it does not change the basic question that is asked here. As far as the EMTALA story, it is true, and as a matter of fact, he later did use it, when they applied for the CON for the cathlab. The other hospital filed the automatic "appeal" to try to stop it, the CEO reminded them of the favor he performed, and they quickly dropped the appeal, so he was right, or you could say his strategy was smart.

If fact, as it seems to be your contention Flaming that this happens all the time...what motivation do you find that a Dr or nurse in an ER would have for covering for a paramedic, or any ambulance crew in general? As the vast majority of services are not hospital based, why would they risk their careers to do so? Just curious. Dwayne I dont think it happens all the time, but i am fairly sure it happens more than it should. Of course we would know how often it occurs if the people in this room asked their directors, and posted the numbers, but that will never happen. I believe it is one of those unspoken rules, like cops dont give cops tickets, and it is our engrained CULTURE in the medical world. I remember at one of the hospitals I worked at, we had another hospital do an illegal transfer to our facility which was a blatent COBRA/EMTALA violation. Of course the ER Nurses wanted it reported, but the CEO said NO, instead he called that hospital's CEO and let him know what happened, then that CEO owed him a big favor in the future. I have seen doctors and nurses make mistakes several times, it was usually not reported to anyone. They don't rat each other out unless they have to. I believe they see us as an extension of themselves, and as part of the team. Plus, it just creates more work for them if they do report it. With that being said, I do not think they see it as putting their careers at risk, after all, they did not make the mistake, and as you pointed out, they are not our employer. Reminds me of a story that I can use as an allegory: Newlywed is cooking dinner for husband, wants to cook a potroast. She takes the big piece of beef, and cuts the top third off and throws it away. Husband can't believe what he sees, and asks why she threw away a perfectly good piece of meat ? She says thats the way Mom always did it. He asks why, she says dont know, never asked. So wife calls mom, and asks and gets the same answer she just gave her husband, "thats the way your grandma did it, and I never asked why". So they call grandma and ask her, they get same answer, "thats the way your great grandma did it, I never asked why. So they go to the nursing home to ask great grandma why she did it, the answer was..................................... *** Cause we were poor, and only had one, very small pot. The meat wouldn't fit in it. We did not have refrigerators back then, just an icebox. **** Highlight the area between the asterisks above and change the color to read answer (currently typed in white). In medicine, we do alot of things because thats the way it was always done.

Everyone that is against reporting errors because it might cost their job dwayne

New monk reports to monestary , he is allowed to speak 2 words every year on anniversary date. First year he says "bed hard ", next year he says "food bad " 3rd year he says "I quit", head monk says I am not surprised you have done nothing but bitch since u got here

Personal cell phone ringtones while on duty

In a sense yes, more calls mean more revenue, if u are in Podunk running 2 calls per shift and u r paying los angeles wages, u will either go bankrupt or be privatized soon

Don't laugh as I go all hoover on u, but it is rumored that the ocutards are being funded by the american communist party, but heard on FOX so use a grain of salt

Ak you do not know that will happen. They may or may not sue. And your employer should not fire u for 1 miistake. I was not there, and there were reversal versions to the story, but regardless, we know mistakes happen routinely, just google Washington dc ems

Like I said earler, the EMS gossip line is faster than 4G internet, everyone in the department knew about it within a week's time. But they only knew that they got a refusal and the patient later died. The hospital contacted our chief, there was an investigation, but I do not know the specifics of what happened to them (I know they were not fired), and I do not know if they ever told the family, or just showed them the refusal paperwork.

Quite easy, here is a real life example. Called to 43 year old male complaining of right wrist/arm pain only, thinks he strained it lifting weights (has cardiac history of a cath 2 years ago that showed some blockage and HBP). Medic spends all of 7 minutes on the scene, takes B/P (was normal) and has patient test his range of motion of arm/wrist/fingers/shoulder, tells him to go see his doctor or go to the ER, gets a refusal, leaves the patient at home (never put him on monitor or did any other assessment). Patient walks into ER 2.5 hours later, and drops dead in triage from an MI. Medics documented that they offered to transport (EMT confidentially tells coworker they did not, medic was a little pissed that he got called out for arm pain). Guy called wife at work and told him the ambulance crew said he should go get it checked out, and let her know that he was on the way to ER. If he had not told her that, no one would have ever knew that EMS got a refusal on him (he was home alone).

Yes ruff, if i caused a patients death or serious injury, I think they have the right to know, if it costs me my job that is the cost of the error. If I were working at a place that built dump trucks, and I had an error so horrible that it had major ramifications on my employer, I would expect to be fired. I do not see how anyone can claim to be a patient advocate, except when it might cost me my job. Thank you for checking into that, I hope more will do the same. I would not report a minor error that caused no harm. Have I always felt this way, NO. But that is part of the growth process, you make alot of mistakes when young, and you learn from them, and hopefully your views change as you learn. There is not a person in this room that would not be upset if a nurse killed their family member, swept it under the rug, and then found out the truth sometime later. I would not feed you anything I would not eat, I will not ask you to do a job that I will not do. I think my patients deserve the same care that I would expect for me or my family. Yes a mistake can hurt you in this career, but we all knew that when we joined up. None of us are perfect, but that is why we should do everything to minimize mistakes (as you have stated your service does), but killing a patient is still killing a patient.

I am not sure your medical records as a minor will show up, and I am not sure why they would ask that before interview. Usually, health questions are something you answer for your health insurance application after you are hired. With that being said, they do have to make sure you are fit enough to do the job, and will usually require a physical. If asked, I would just disclose any current medical problems to the Physician who is examining you.

I would suggest the following since you stated you wanted it for your own learning only: Paragraph 1 is your introduction. Paragraph 2 a broad overview of the disease Paragraph 3 Signs and Symptoms, related history, co-morbidities, how you differentiate this problem with similar problems (if doing asthma, how do you differentiate from CHF, COPD) Paragraph 4 the current EMS treatment of this disease, including medications. Paragraph 5 Contradictions to the current treatment listed above (when does treatment differ). Paragraph 6 How is treatment different for different populations (pediatric, elderly, obese). Paragraph 7 Are there second tier treatments that you can employ if Plan A does not work (Mag or epi for asthma, Dobutamine for CHF).