Another of those pesky tough questions

[Just Plain Ruff]

Ok, lets see if I can make this sensible and not ramble but no promises

Let's say you were taken care of by paramedic A and you suffered some adverse effects.

You are in need of an ambulance again and paramedic A is the responding paramedic.

In your service area can you request a different medic to transport you? Or are you stuck with only one choice.

If you are in this situation and the service says that there is no-one else to respond to help you and you are stuck with paramedic A what are your options?

Just curious as I have come across this situation happen at times in the past. I was the medic who responded as the replacement medic.

Discuss

(by the way please do not use this particular thread to point fingers at specific providers or I'll request it be locked)

[stcommodore]

doesn't sound like an issue for public discussion. This is best left between you and the group and person you have the issue with.

[paramedicmike]

I've seen this happen more frequently than I thought I would. It doesn't always revolve around prior bad experiences. I've seen people request other medics because they didn't want to be treated by a woman, or by a black man, or by a white man etc...

In any area I've worked there has not been an offer made to call another ambulance. The standard response has been, "You called 911 for help. 911 sent us here to help. You can either accept the help we're offering or decline the help. What do you want to do?"

Most people, surprisingly enough, accept the help.

I've had people request that my old partner treat them because I am a white male and he's black. My old partner had people request that I take care of them because he's black. Usually, and I can't think of any specific example to the contrary, we refused to switch. This was by mutual agreement. Why cave to the bigotry?

I realize this has nothing to do specifically with prior care provided. I just thought it fit into a wider area of the same discussion.

-be safe

[Just Plain Ruff]

doesn't sound like an issue for public discussion. This is best left between you and the group and person you have the issue with.

I said no personal discussions or I'd have it locked, you did see that part right???

I was simply asking whether or not your service had in place the ability to send a different medic to take over for the one who the patient refuses to go with.

What ramifications would there be if you could not provide them with a viable alternative? Are they forced to go in the ambulance of the one who they have basically said they won't go with or do you let them refuse and not provide them with service?

[paramedicmike]

I can't make them go. If they refuse, they do so knowing full well the potential complications or end results. Many times we'd get the ER doc on the phone and let the two of them hash it out. If they still refused, we had them sign the refusal. If they refused to sign that, we had a cop witness the refusing the refusal.

Seriously, though, if they can sit and argue with you about the race/gender of the medic providing care, just how sick are they? ;)

Now that I've had time to think, there was one occasion where we specifically requested one of our female medics stay beyond the end of her shift. We were summoned by police for a female sexual assault victim. We figured the victim didn't really want to deal with two guys. Once we explained what was going on the female medic gladly stayed and it worked out all around.

That's an exceptionally rare occurrence, though.

-be safe

[Scaramedic]

Long long ago, in a galaxy far, far way...

(kiss my ass HPAA)

I had a patient who would Paramedic search, she defined FREQUENT flyer. I am serious, business flyers probably had less miles than her. If a Paramedic she did not like (me for instance 8) ) showed up she would no haul, listen to her scanner and wait for us to get a call and then call 911 again. Nary a real medical complaint just a sad lonely person.

Peace,

Marty

P.S. Actually she liked me, just not my partner, she wanted all male crews.

[AnthonyM83]

Perfectly reasonable discussion topic.

No, our system does not have that option in place.

[Yummymedic05]

I was the only night shift female paramedic, so if a call came out that sounded "female issue" I HAD to be the medic, if it didn't and turned out to be a lady problem typically I was requested. Patient's did have their favorites and would request, but since it was hospital based typicallty they'd see their super medic inside the ER.

[Just Plain Ruff]

I can understand the not being able to accomodate the patient in situations where you are the only medic out there but what about the larger services who have at times 4 or more units on the street.

If the patient has a bonafide medical issue and is refusing to go with a particular paramedic due to an issue in the past isn't there any way in your service that another ambulance can be sent. We have an obligation to care for the patient and when we refuse to budge and not send a unit then could that person not have a case against the service saying that there were units available and care was refused.

I know that you can come back and say we provided the service they did not take part in it but I think that's a cop out. The patient obviously has a problem with paramedic A and refuses to go with them. We then say, your options are this paramedic or you sign a refusal. Isn't that kin to forcing a refusal.

I have had the situation where the patient was very unhappy with me for not giving them the medications they wanted and when they got me as the responder they said they weren't going. I told the patient that it's either me or no-one, they went to the hospital with me. We ended up doing a lot of talking on the way and in the end we came to a sort of truce and the call wasn't so bad.

I'm getting off track here but my real question is I guess, if you have the units available would your service send a 2nd ambulance if the patient refused to go with the first?

The second question would be is if your service refused to send another ambulance and the patient refused to go to the hospital could that not be considered a EMS Forced refusal in all reality. Since the patient wanted to go to the hospital but not with that particular medic.

One other example -

female patient, transported by Carlos the sex addict. She is touched inappropriately by carlos. Investigation ensues and no wrong doing by carlos is found but the patient continues to believe he touched her inappropriately. She falls down and breaks her arm. Carlos is the responding paramedic. She refulses to go to the hospital with Carlos but obviously needs to go for treatment. Ambulance service refuses to call 2nd ambulance and she is told it's Carlos or no-transport.

Could that not be considered a EMS forced-refusal?

And would she have a claim in court?

[spenac]

In my primary service they are stuck with the crew that shows up. At my second service in theory I could call for a second ambulance. But I have to agree that if they're well enough to argue who will take them they probably don't need the ambulance anyway. Now if they have an actual gripe as with sex addict carlos he might have to drive and let his partner at what ever level take patient care, if no other rigs available.