Arizona Victim Thought Dead, Not

[p3medic]

I don't know, you have seven pts, you find this one not breathing, you open the airway, still not breathing = deceased. Now, once you have more resources he probably needed to get tx, but playing devil's advocate here I can see how initially he could be called. Now, if they just looked in at the pt and called him, different story.

[crotchitymedic1986]

Dont be so quick to judge, I experienced one of these. Female ejected in interstate accident, I arrived as commander shortly after first ambulance. Female was apneic, pulseless, crew had triaged her as dead and moved on to the others. I noted her color was just too good, and rechecked a pulse, didnt find one -- asked crew to put a monitor on her, she had a sinus brady at 30-40, still couldnt feel her pulse, but decided to work her; got her rate and pressure up, she died the next day at the trauma center. Would she have come back to life when the coroner jostled her body about, maybe she would have been dead-dead a few minutes later -- who knows ?

[VentMedic]

she died the next day at the trauma center. Would she have come back to life when the coroner jostled her body about, maybe she would have been dead-dead a few minutes later -- who knows ?

But, if she lived for 24 hours and had been declared brain dead, think of the several others that may have had their lives saved by organ transplants. There are also now guidelines where brain death is not always a necessary criteria for organ transplant. While some in EMS see the near dead as a useless transport, others in the health care professions see it as an opportunity for some patients to regain their quality of life.

Edited May 31, 2009 by VentMedic

[croaker260]

Why is it always a fire department?

Speaking of Fire Departments....

Police: man had sex with

teenage cousin

Updated: Thursday, 28 May 2009, 9:17 AM EDT

Published : Thursday, 28 May 2009, 8:50 AM EDT

SARASOTA - A Sarasota man is facing charges of lewd and lascivious battery and incest after police say he had sex with his 15-year-old cousin.

Police arrested Christopher Kilduff, 28, Wednesday night.

According to the arrest affidavit, the victim said Kilduff offered her Oxycodone and marijuana, which she declined, and then he asked her to have sex with him.

Arrest records show Kilduff, who listed his occupation as an [b]EMT with the Sarasota County Fire Department, is being held in the county jail in $10,000 bond.

Sorry ...couldnt resist.

[FireMedic65]

Speaking of Fire Departments....

Police: man had sex with

teenage cousin

Updated: Thursday, 28 May 2009, 9:17 AM EDT

Published : Thursday, 28 May 2009, 8:50 AM EDT

SARASOTA - A Sarasota man is facing charges of lewd and lascivious battery and incest after police say he had sex with his 15-year-old cousin.

Police arrested Christopher Kilduff, 28, Wednesday night.

According to the arrest affidavit, the victim said Kilduff offered her Oxycodone and marijuana, which she declined, and then he asked her to have sex with him.

Arrest records show Kilduff, who listed his occupation as an [b]EMT with the Sarasota County Fire Department, is being held in the county jail in $10,000 bond.

Sorry ...couldnt resist.

This is already being discussed

http://www.emtcity.com/index.php?showtopic=15323

[Jeepluv77]

While some in EMS see the near dead as a useless transport, others in the health care professions see it as an opportunity for some patients to regain their quality of life.

Wtf!? I thought this was part of why we're here. Hell, if we only transported the walking wounded what would be the point to all the training? Anyone that is too lazy, insecure, whatever to work with the near dead probably need to find a new line of work and stop stop stripping patients of their chance at life because they(the EMT) aren't up to the challenge.

[Dustdevil]

We can argue TRIAGE all day long, and the answers will vary with resources and conditions. With limited resources, he would indeed be the lowest priority. Expected is always the lowest priority. However, even the lowest priority gets transported. Even in combat we don't just leave people behind on the battlefield to die. I don't care if they only have one ambulance in the county, and they have to make three or four trips to pick them all up, you still transport anyone and everyone with a pulse. So really, TRIAGE is not a factor here.

[ERDoc]

Dont be so quick to judge, I experienced one of these. Female ejected in interstate accident, I arrived as commander shortly after first ambulance. Female was apneic, pulseless, crew had triaged her as dead and moved on to the others. I noted her color was just too good, and rechecked a pulse, didnt find one -- asked crew to put a monitor on her, she had a sinus brady at 30-40, still couldnt feel her pulse, but decided to work her; got her rate and pressure up, she died the next day at the trauma center. Would she have come back to life when the coroner jostled her body about, maybe she would have been dead-dead a few minutes later -- who knows ?

Didn't we already have a threat about traumatic PEA? I think the consensus is that it gets worked. Now the question is, if you check a pulse and find none, do you really need to put the monitor on the pt?

[p3medic]

Didn't we already have a threat about traumatic PEA? I think the consensus is that it gets worked. Now the question is, if you check a pulse and find none, do you really need to put the monitor on the pt?

No.

[Just Plain Ruff]

If they had performed an adequate assessment on the patient, even during triage - they would have realized that this patient was an immediate priority and should have likely went before any of the others - providing care wasn't delayed by extrication. But even then, as soon as the patient is free, he's high-priority and off the scene. He definitely wouldn't have been last, not until he's really, truly, no doubt about it - DEAD!

Here we go again with the assumptions.

We assume that they didn't do an adequate assessment. Were any of us there?

If indeed a poor assessment was done then by all means, remediation and discipline but if there were 7 people in the wreck and this one guy met the black criteria then there you go.

Unless any of us were there then we need to stop being so freakin judgmental and shut the hell up.