Union Affiliations

[VentMedic]

[reaper]

I see so the market's had nothing to do with it, nor did the price of gas, or that the car makers profit margin, nor a recession had any influence ... looks like we all know where you stand.

But saying that (I want too make it very clear these are not my words)

The UAW fought for autoworkers to make $40.00 an hr, for a job that is worth $15-18 an hr

Did you want to join Jimmy Hoffa so have you been fitted with cement shoes and are you nuts, cause you sure aint smart .... well, with that post.

I will send flowers.

Well, To this post I say "bring them ON" I have many already in the family and know the workings of the auto industry.

To the rest, I think Vent has summed it up very nicely. I will take a National voice over a local voice. You fix it at the National level and the pay increases will follow.

I pay association dues once a year and a very small amount to boot. You pay union dues in a large amount!

[tniuqs]

Well, To this post I say "bring them ON" I have many already in the family and know the workings of the auto industry.

So do you have access to a witness protection program too ? How the UAW has any bearing on a professional association or union in EMS, but comparing it to a "trade" is way beyond me on this one.

To the rest, I think Vent has summed it up very nicely. I will take a National voice over a local voice. You fix it at the National level and the pay increases will follow.

Our Health care system is very, very different the Provinces are the funding bodies, not our National level, they dictate some conditions is all.

Yes thats great but lets compare what you pay in health care insurance costs I bet with even huge as you call it union dues we still come up ahead.

We in Alberta are basically forced by Alberta Government and are on the brink of it this very minute, to form some type of representation to protect rights and job standards many are very concerned with scope of practice thing is as without any representation, honestly who will speak for us, Firefighters, Nurses or MDs perhaps ?

The private operators that threaten employees with termination because they want just more than just wage increases they want effective representation first, a say in their own future's is all. There is presently no collective voice other than a regulatory body that has let us downas a group, that too dictated by government. We the EMS providers did not start a war the government drew first blood, restructuring everything and placing the future of all EMS in limbo.

Stand and be counted don't hide in fear all I am saying, the rural areas will be the individuals that suffer honestly, major communities like our CUPE got level 3 vest for their guys ... rural if you lucky you may get a high visability vest.

Ventmedic: I know this is not my house as in Canada Labour Unions for the most part do promote the profession (s) its all dependant on the structure and bylaws of the this or that Asscociation or Union, agreed some are good some are self promoting, some are member driven just saying can't paint them all with the same brush. The regulatory body for Paramedics sucks, but the College for Respiratory Therapists does awesome work.

But I do apreaciate your well written information, always do.

[letmesleep]

Unionization or association, either way we are using the tool available to us to better the work environment and the system as best we can. Is it your business how much is coming out of MY pocket for this? The point of the matter is, is that in any regard we are all after the same thing aren't we? I have said it before in this thread, if all is working great without a union, a union is not needed, and I doubt seriously that you will hear one union member dispute that statement. I have also admitted that the IAFF may NOT be the best thing for EMS, however is there a better union out there for those of us who utilize those services? As you can see at the top of page 4, mstovall is involved with the Boilermakers local P-3. How exactly is there union better for EMS than the IAFF? The point here is that we always read complaints of lack of pay, longevity in the field sucks, work conditions are crap, we are NOT recognized as a profession, and constantly there are those here who state clearly that "NO CHANGE WILL EVER OCCUR UNTIL YOU GET OFF YOUR ASS AND DO SOMETHING TO EFFECT CHANGE", so how have those here that are adamantly anti-union effecting change for OUR profession? How is it that your means are BETTER than the way we (those of us who are unionized) have chosen to effect change?

[p3medic]

If you look around the country at cities with non fire based, non private EMS you will see a labor organization representing them. This is what keeps the IAFF/FD at bay. I am all for a united national voice for EMS, that doesn't take their marching orders from the fire service. My union leadership has a voice in several national EMS organizations, and lobby at the city and state level. We have friends in Washington and are actively pursuing a national EMS memorial in DC that won't be a plywood board in a shopping mall in rural Virginia. From a somewhat selfish point of view, my union has negotiated with the city for better pay and benefits, on par with fire and police. This allows me to own a home, and live reasonably well without having to work 3 jobs and live on public assistance.

[tniuqs]

Unionization or association, either way we are using the tool available to us to better the work environment and the system as best we can. Is it your business how much is coming out of MY pocket for this? The point of the matter is, is that in any regard we are all after the same thing aren't we? I have said it before in this thread, if all is working great without a union, a union is not needed, and I doubt seriously that you will hear one union member dispute that statement. I have also admitted that the IAFF may NOT be the best thing for EMS, however is there a better union out there for those of us who utilize those services? As you can see at the top of page 4, mstovall is involved with the Boilermakers local P-3. How exactly is there union better for EMS than the IAFF? The point here is that we always read complaints of lack of pay, longevity in the field sucks, work conditions are crap, we are NOT recognized as a profession, and constantly there are those here who state clearly that "NO CHANGE WILL EVER OCCUR UNTIL YOU GET OFF YOUR ASS AND DO SOMETHING TO EFFECT CHANGE", so how have those here that are adamantly anti-union effecting change for OUR profession? How is it that your means are BETTER than the way we (those of us who are unionized) have chosen to effect change?

BRAVO excellent post !

So I to have a dream:

1- To become a member of a group whatever a union/ or association to have enough clout on a National level and local level to have cajones enough to influence politicians to listen, FIRSTLY to be an true advocate for the profession of Paramedicine, because ALL of us do put patient care as the Prime Objective.

2- That represents only the intersts of the EMS profession, not a mish mash of others in the mix.

3- That will stand beside me if I get a dumb ass groundless grievance (job security is rather important to me) and not have someone represent me that has never been on the street, soaking wet and covered in crap and just had to pronounce a dead kid.

4-That has barganing rights, otherwise one is sandpapering their asses, hey I AM WORTH SOMETHING TOO!

5- That as a member have a say in union dues (bylaws that have some teeth and control costs from within) and educational funds available so that I can go to this conference or that without me having to eat KD for a month.

Presently in my hood my brothers and sisters are divided (and not by our own hand either) employers using fear tactics and using fear of the unknow, combine this with vast changes to a system without any even lip service given to the people that it will directly affect.

[VentMedic]

It seems that some of you do have some confusion about unions and national professional associations in the U.S. I can not speak for anything in Canada.

A professional association will:

* help to initiate legislation

* collect employment data for worth evaluation

* provide education advice

* work with state and national education committees for standards

* help establish national standards and national credentials

* work with the national testing agency to ensure quality

* provide CEUs that are nationally accepted

* establish state and regional offices for localized assistance

* provide employment information with a national database

* promote research

* Professional advisory panels with physicians as members

* portability of membership - it will go anywhere with you with the same benefits

* continuous negotiations and not just when the contracts are due (I got 3 large raises in one year as an RRT after the higher educational standard became effective. I also get paid for education above the minimum and can get promoted according to qualifications instead of just senority.)

Examples of national associations:

AARC - Respiratory - www.aarc.org

APTA - Physical Therapy - http://www.apta.org

AACN - Critical Care Nurses - http://www.aacn.org

ANA - American Nursing Association http://www.nursingworld.org/

For EMS:

How many of your unions tell you the progress of each piece of legislature that might influence EMS and your job? There are EMS organizations that will do that like NAEMT and Advocates for EMS.

http://www.capwiz.com/naemt/issues/bills/

How many members in the boilermakers union that hold positions of status have any medical background? Teamsters?

Is a laborer from an entirely different profession advocating for your "standards", education and advanced protocols or more legislation to expand your scope of practice?

Is that talked about at the union meetings in detail with physicians present to iron out the rough patches?

Are there physicians as members of your union's board or on the advisory panels?

Do you have advisory panels that can be contacted about field medicine related issues or legislation?

Or, is it only the wage issues that are discussed so they don't have to acknowledge that they have no idea what you do except for being a laborer on an ambulance?

Do they offer national educational conferences for you to get CEUs and learn about the latest technology or procedures?

Can the union advise you on educational issues and give information for your next career move?

How many unions will still care about you if you take a job with another company that may not be union or has a different union?

In other words how portable is your membership?

[letmesleep]

'A bill to amend the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to provide recruitment and retention incentives for volunteer emergency service workers.'

Bill # S.1840

Original Sponsor:

Hillary Clinton (D-NY)

Cosponsor Total: 3

(last sponsor added 10/03/2007)

2 Democrats

1 Independents

About This Legislation:

7/20/2007--Introduced. Volunteer Emergency Services Recruitment and Retention Act of 2007 - Amends the Internal Revenue Code to allow sponsors of certain deferred compensation plans to elect to include length of service award plans for bona fide volunteers providing fire fighting and prevention services, emergency medical services, ambulance services, and emergency rescue services. Directs the Secretary of Labor to issue regulations exempting a length of service award program from treatment as an employee pension benefit plan under the Employee Retirement Income Security Act of 1974 (ERISA).

found here: http://www.emtcity.com/phpBB2/link.php?url...t/issues/bills/

So am I wrong or are these the type of issues that the NAEMT are lobbying for? This of course is only one of the issues I found on your web address Vent, the others that I saw immediately were for monies to be distributed to homeland security and the DOT. I'm sure that if you go to www.IAFF.org you will find issues in regards to FFs that are being lobbied for in congress, which can be construed as NOT EMS related. I have NO doubt that this argument could be thrown back in my face in regards to the IAFF. My point is that the NAEMT is lobbying for EMS VOLUNTEERS which are just as evil here in EMTcity as FIREFIGHTERS, so how is the NAEMT any better than the IAFF in this situation?

[tniuqs]

Note to self:

Never have an argument with Ventmedic.

[VentMedic]

While volunteers are evil on this forum they are in no way outlawed. It is possible that volunteers may have taken an active interest on their own behalf and got on that committee while paid employees have been trying to get the Plumbers and Pipefitters union to aide them.

The IAFF is also very similiar to the strong nursing associations that eventually evolved into a union type represention of its members when their voice became strong. ANA which I mentioned earlier has now developed affiliations with strong union ties. However, they both are very focused on their own agendas. If EMS has that type of representation, then maybe things could be different.

And yes, I did list ANA under associations because some of their issues benefit nursing as a profession.

Unions that cross the lines to pick up every laborer they can are professional salespeople who have no other agenda then negotiating what they think is appropriate for a profession they know little about. Money is money and professionalism is not on the list of things to do. That will have to come from someplace else and yes, healthcare professionals can belong to both professional associations and laborer unions especially in closed shop areas.