Stations or posts?

[Richard B the EMT]

When I said that the CSL postings were on computer recommendation, I neglected to mention that the computer is also presuming where the next call will be coming in from, in addition to figuring in area population, expected traffic conditions, ect. Even the IBM "Blue Max" can't predict when grandma is going to have her heart attack, so I think it is still "hit and miss". It does seem to work.

As to my station, to use it as an example, the supervisor, a BLS truck, the Haz-Tec medic truck, another BLS truck, the regular medic truck, and my BLS truck all start at half hour intervals. We might not see each other for days, or all get stuck at the hospital's triage desk, or waiting for ED beds, which is when we see each other (except the supervisor, who makes sure each unit goes into service on time, so he or she will see each unit on their tour at the start).

On a different matter: While my FDNY building is a station (Station 47), it is also a firehouse, with a ladder company, an engine company, and a fire battalion. If you live at the building, as firefighters do, it is a fire HOUSE, if you just change into and out of your uniform and restock as needed there, it is a STATION. This definition is supplied courtesy of several firefighters I have known over the years

[JakeEMTP]

We are station based here. Most of the comforts of home. There are two ambulances and a rescue truck ( which I have never scene moved other than it gets started every Sunday, generator run and washed). Our response times are under 8 min as we are very centrally located in our district.

I have never worked in a SSM system so it would be hard for me to comment one way or the other on that. I like be at the station where we can relax, cook, nap and study. :study:

[Richard B the EMT]

Oops, yet another item I neglected to mention: The CSLs are tied into the Computer Assisted Dispatch system (11 years working in the communications office, and I forgot that?).

[weasel 108]

Where I work, we have a two ALS ambulances and two BLS ambulances(although sometimes the BLS units are out doing raisin runs) in the station on my rotation. I never worked for a department that used posts.

[mrsmall]

Do you think cost is the reason for our county not having stations? We have like 50 ambulances, and a large county.. But the only thing that would bug me is that if we can't afford stations, why can the fire department afford to have many many stations?

[Dustdevil]

Do you think cost is the reason for our county not having stations?

That is certainly an oft cited consideration. And at the start-up, it is certainly a valid one. Fifty stations comes to $25 million dollars at least, plus construction time, etc... Then there is maintenence, etc... No stations equals a much faster and cheaper start-up. But, of course, those numbers don't tell the whole story. Now you are running your ambulances almost 24 hours a day without ever turning them off. You're rolling them more miles too. Your vehicle maintenance and replacement costs are skyrocketing, compared to a stationed ambulance system. If nobody has yet (I suspect they have), I would sure like to see a study that gives us ten-year projections on the cost of starting up and running a station-based system versus a SSM system. I'm betting that the $25 million you "saved" by not building stations is a drop in the bucket over what you spent on high mileage vehicle maintenance.

But the only thing that would bug me is that if we can't afford stations, why can the fire department afford to have many many stations?

The FD is probably working 24 hour shifts, and you probably are not. If not, you don't need no stinking stations. If you wanted a job where you could sit on your arse and sleep all day, you should have become a fireman.

Folks, this is just another area where we need to think for ourselves and quit worrying about what the firemonkeys are doing. We are not them, and they are not us. Other than red lights and sirens, there is absolutely no similarity between us and them. And as long as wankers continue to get all hung up on trying to be like them, we will continue to be nothing but second-class labourers with no identity and no respect. It's time to establish what is best for the optimum provision of emergency MEDICAL services and do that.

[BushyFromOz]

That is certainly an oft cited consideration. And at the start-up, it is certainly a valid one. Fifty stations comes to $25 million dollars at least, plus construction time, etc... Then there is maintenence, etc... No stations equals a much faster and cheaper start-up. But, of course, those numbers don't tell the whole story. Now you are running your ambulances almost 24 hours a day without ever turning them off. You're rolling them more miles too. Your vehicle maintenance and replacement costs are skyrocketing, compared to a stationed ambulance system. If nobody has yet (I suspect they have), I would sure like to see a study that gives us ten-year projections on the cost of starting up and running a station-based system versus a SSM system. I'm betting that the $25 million you "saved" by not building stations is a drop in the bucket over what you spent on high mileage vehicle maintenance.

I wonder how you would factor the losses from reduced staff retention, loss of productivity, generally shittier staff and associated cost of training replacements into this? Could be difficult to cost out as the US system from what i gather is largely worker pays his own way type gig.

[Dustdevil]

I wonder how you would factor the losses from reduced staff retention, loss of productivity, generally shittier staff and associated cost of training replacements into this? Could be difficult to cost out as the US system from what i gather is largely worker pays his own way type gig.

Exactly. Those factors you mentioned are not negatives in American EMS. They are positives! Why would management want to retain staff long term? The longer somebody works for you, the more likely it is you will have to give them a raise. God forbid that somebody might actually stay long enough to earn retirement benefits. Now THERE is a cost for you! So, it is much preferable to pay low wages and treat them like $hit so they don't stay very long. And, as long as we keep the educational standards down to 120 hours of 6th grade level first aid training, there will never be a shortage of replacement suckers.

The two largest private providers in the U.S. have both been around for nearly 30 years, yet I have never heard of anybody working for either of them long enough to retire. There it is.

[JPINFV]

On a different matter: While my FDNY building is a station (Station 47), it is also a firehouse, with a ladder company, an engine company, and a fire battalion. If you live at the building, as firefighters do, it is a fire HOUSE, if you just change into and out of your uniform and restock as needed there, it is a STATION. This definition is supplied courtesy of several firefighters I have known over the years

If EMS lives there, wouldn't it be an EMS House also?

/seperate but unequal

[Richard B the EMT]

You'll understand if I decline to respond to that one?