Connie31079 Posted March 23, 2006 Author Share Posted March 23, 2006 nsmedic: I have no idea who you are. You say you've met me once, that may be true, but I wouldn't know you if I tripped over you in the street. I'm not trying to "pass the buck" at all. Up until I heard the info from the firefighter who was on-scene of the MVC and saw the wires hanging out of the defib 4 days before I found the problem, I was 100% completely ready to accept the fact that it was my fault. I found the problem, and I didn't report it until the end of the shift. Simple, end of story, my fault. But I think some responsibility should be shared between the crews that didn't "notice" or report the problem in the 4 days before I found it. I was just speaking with my SOP about it, his stance on all of this is "well, nobody can verify that the problem actually DID exist 4 days before, and even if it did, nobody is admitting to it, so I guess it didn't happen. Because you found it on Tuesday, we have to assume that the problem occured on Tuesday, end of story." So, as a result, I'm getting 100% of the blame, and NOBODY else is being punished, AT ALL!! I'm completely willing and ready to accept my punishment......my beef is, I don't think I should be the only one penalized. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustdevil Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 I remain completely appalled at the lack of understanding of simple managerial and supervisory leadership principles here. I sure hope that the people who are actually in such positions have had some formal training in this matter, because it is obvious that the concept is not well understood by many of those commenting here. So here I offer... PERSONNEL MANAGEMENT 101 Human Relations for Complete Idiots Punishment went out in the 1960's. It was universally dismissed as not only non-productive, but actually counterproductive to the intended goals. The goal here is twofold; You want to FIX the problem, and you want to PREVENT it from occurring again. The term is REMEDIATION. Punishment is giving her three days off from work to sit and sulk and fertilize her resentment of management, her co-workers, and the organization as a whole, while paying time and a half to somebody to cover her shifts. Real productive, eh? Remediation is taking her off the truck for three days of driving to check out the monitors on every truck from Bigby to Glace Bay, and making the crews at each station watch her do it and sign a form witnessing that it is in working and serviceable order. Which one makes more sense? It's a no brainer. And if your management doesn't recognize the difference, I'm damn glad I don't work for EHS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Plain Ruff Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 ok, I'll take the suspension out of the picture but You cannot go back and suspend or reprimand all the people who were on the truck from Friday on because you were the one who noticed it and decided to to say something and then let it "slip" your mind. The buck stops here so to say. All you needed to do was say, "We're out of service, equipment issue" and drive back to the station and replace the monitor and then get back in service. surely your crew isn't the only ambulance on the street. You could have even requested a supervisor to come replace the monitor. So I stand by my statement that you are the one who is responsible and you are the one who failed to report it so you are the one who will be punished over this. I know it sucks but that's the way it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustdevil Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 Why does anybody need to be held "responsible?" What adverse outcome are you holding them responsible for? What tangible occurrence are they being punished for? And what greater purpose is served by holding them "responsible" for it? Is the core problem addressed? Is the employee properly re-educated? Are the others involved -- and the team at large -- allowed to benefit from your action? What is your operational justification for your decision? What are you trying to achieve? What greater good are you effecting for your organization? How do you expect your actions to positively affect the team and prevent further occurrences of simple forgetfulness? You're not a judge, jury, or executioner. You have NO interest in "justice." You are a personnel manager. And your ONLY interest should be the good of the organization. Otherwise, you are just as guilty of poor judgement as the employee in question. Myopia is not a desirable management quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bullmedic Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 If it was not reported here you certainly would be reprimanded. No suspension but surely a reprimand. All of the medics that did not notice it before, if that could be substantiated, would get a letter too. We are required to put our unit out of service for that type of problem or contact the supervisor during the call if that is when it is discovered. How bad would you have felt if your next call was the one that the defib was needed and it was not functional? How would you handle that? Would you then tell on yourself and say hey I noticed that on the last call but it just slipped my mind? Or would you realize the trouble you might be in and say hey it looked good to me when I checked it this am? When I am wrong I am wrong. Easier to take the hit and go on than to try to fight a losing battle. Of course we do not have a union so that is not even a consideration. Just chalk it up to a learning experience and be more vigilant in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Connie31079 Posted March 23, 2006 Author Share Posted March 23, 2006 By the way, my partner that I worked with that day who checked the defib during the truck check.........she's a casual, only worked here a couple of times, so she can't be disciplined. How you going to discipline a casual? Say you can't work here anymore? She's only worked here a couple of times! No loss to her!! She'll find work in other areas of the province. And I was speaking with her on the phone yesterday, she had no idea that I was being disciplined for this. She hasn't even gotten as much as a phone call to discuss what happened that day. She didn't even know there was an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnatomyChick Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 Doesnt matter what happened 4 days ago, a week ago, or the like. You can only account for yourself, and the equipment on the squad now. If its found to be missing, malfunctioning or out of place, its still on YOU. YOUR responsibility to check, and maintain it. Your failure to report it, happens. You still should be held responsible. Doesnt matter what anyone else did before you. Check it to a learning experience, and move on. Man... I hate it when I have to agree with James.... However, it's happening again. I agree 100% with this post. This shouldn't be about the blame game... it's time to realize that you are responsible for your actions and that is that. Do I think you should be suspended.. probably not.. do I think that there should be some remediation effort and a letter put in your file, absolutely! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dustdevil Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 Man... I hate it when I have to agree with James.... However, it's happening again. I agree 100% with this post. This shouldn't be about the blame game... It sounds to me like you actually disagree with James' post. What he said is that it is completely about the blame game. It's about management finding somebody to blame, and somebody accepting that blame. He said nothing about fixing the problem. He said nothing about a program to assure it doesn't happen again. He said nothing about addressing the issue with others involved. His entire plan is to summarily blame somebody and move on as if the problem no longer exists. How in the world do you interpret that as not being a blame game? It doesn't matter whether it is Connie or management doing the blaming. It is still very clearly a blame game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jw-c152 Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 Wow. And you wonder why EMS is still a second rate occupation in many areas of North America. In no other occupation will you find colleagues so willing to rip your head off and feed it to the pirhanas. If we, as one big EMS community, want to gain the respect, public support, pay increases, professional status, etc. that we deserve then we must stick together. We must support each other and our profession. Every one of us has made errors. Nobody's perfect. Mistakes will be made. That doesn't mean we should go running to management to get them suspended. Instead, we as a group should be protesting that suspension. If it can happen to one person, it WILL happen to another, then another, and then eventually... YOU. What EMS is lacking, IMO, is the 'brotherhood' (females included - 'siblinghood' ??) that Police and Fire have. They are a team. They support each other in good times and bad. Have you ever been to a police LODD funeral? Wow. Officers from all over the continent attend. That's because of the respect they have for each other just because they perform the same job. Connie, I don't believe you should be suspended, or disciplined in any manner. In fact, I'd like to thank you for recognizing a problem with that equipment and reporting it so that it could be replaced and your (OUR as an EMS brotherhood) patients received the best care possible. I respect you all as EMS professionals, but guys, come on.. let's stop eating our young and hanging the old, and tattling on each other. That's it for me. Later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnatomyChick Posted March 23, 2006 Share Posted March 23, 2006 Dustdevil "It sounds to me like you actually disagree with James' post. What he said is that it is completely about the blame game. It's about management finding somebody to blame, and somebody accepting that blame. " Touche.... I guess I agree about 60% with James.... what I was trying to say is that Connie shouldn't be blaming or "trying to share" the blame with other staff... Buck up and take responsibility (which I realize that she says she has, but in actuality.. she's still blaming the "other" crew(s) )..... Proving anyone noticed those wires showing prior to her is going to be difficult, a more appropriate route (in my eyes) is just to "bite the bullet" and go on. As James said.. "Lesson Learned". I would lay odds that she will NEVER make that mistake again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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