December Ambulance Crash Log

[akflightmedic]

I would love to see those facts AK, please open a new thread and share them

Nah, you bore me for the most part.

[BEorP]

crotchity, if your intentions are to do something useful for the profession then I cannot fault you for that. You are kidding yourself and misleading members of this site if you think that the numbers you are citing mean anything.

Please review the literature on this issue, as many of the things that you are making guesses on have been examined in scientific studies. One that I looked at recently showed that only 43% of crashes occurred at intersections (as opposed to your estimate of 70%). It also had very different numbers than you did in regards to ambulance personnel injuries and fatalities. This of course is just a single study based in a single region that was not perfect, but it is much more scientific than looking at a database of less than 5% of American ambulance crashes.

[VentMedic]

crotchitymedic1986 wrote:

Read any journals or studies regarding cardiac arrests lately??

I can name several other conditions/events that are time sensitive and more critical than an arrest if you wish for a positive outcome.

Even with what the stats say about survival for out of hospital survival, a cardiac arrest call probably gets the most adrenaline pumping next to the pedi calls. There is a preconceived excuse that driving a little faster than usual is more acceptable on these calls. It is also an excuse to drive faster with the L/S to the hospital while essentially working on a dead person. There are stats that have been published to show working a cardiac arrest in the back of a moving ambulance has resulted in many injuries to the providers even if the ambulance doesn't actually crash. And, the patient still remains dead or has their chances for survival diminished due to ineffective CPR in a moving vehicle.

[spenac]

crotchitymedic1986 wrote:

Even with what the stats say about survival for out of hospital survival, a cardiac arrest call probably gets the most adrenaline pumping next to the pedi calls. There is a preconceived excuse that driving a little faster than usual is more acceptable on these calls. It is also an excuse to drive faster with the L/S to the hospital while essentially working on a dead person. There are stats that have been published to show working a cardiac arrest in the back of a moving ambulance has resulted in many injuries to the providers even if the ambulance doesn't actually crash. And, the patient still remains dead or has their chances for survival diminished due to ineffective CPR in a moving vehicle.

And as already posted by someone else a rolling code now is against AHA guidelines which is what a lawyer for the people that your ambulance hits will use to win a law suit against you and your service.

[crotchitymedic1986]

As usual for AK; too bad.

Beorp: The site I am referencing is a site that lists all ambulance accidents that occur in the US that make the news. If you care to click on any of them, you will see that most are very detailed reports about actual crashes. It is quite possible that the two months that I looked at vary from the norm, as that is how you arrive at an average -- you have a high and a low. Please put a link to your "scientific studies" that prove that all of these "real" ambulance accidents are just myths, and must not have happened because you read a study 2 years ago.

Also, I was referencing responding TO a cardiac arrest, not transporting an arrest L/S -- I am against that, and two of the accidents happened while transporting cardiac arrest patients.

[WolfmanHarris]

Facts and studies aside (can't be bothered on this one to be honest), let's do a quick of the cuff comparison. Pediatric croup with severe SOB vs. medical cardiac arrest. One will stay dead the other will potentially get much worse without intervention. So for which is time more critical? Stroke patient en route to a regional stroke centre vs. medical cardiac arrest? One time sensitive one will still be dead and likely won't come back. So for which is time more critical?

[crotchitymedic1986]

I still vote arrest, as you really only have 6-8 minutes to save brain cells, and convert the patient. There are numerous calls where the patient has greater viability, but I was referencing the act of responding to a call at time of dispatch, without knowing anything about the patient. A patient with croup or a CVA patient is still breathing (usually) at the time of dispatch, the arrest patient is not.

[crotchitymedic1986]

I would also note that any "scientific study" will be flawed to some extent. One of the issues that Nadine Levick brought up is that ambulance crashes are not reported to any "1" central agency, and often times the police report will not indicate that the vehicle was an "ambulance", it may just say Ford F-350 or Ford Van. Then think about how many minor accidents are never reported, and repaired by the company without an insurance claim (backed into a pole).

[WolfmanHarris]

Crotch, I've got to ask. Would it ever be possible to convince you that what you "know" if wrong? And if so, how?

[akflightmedic]

As usual for AK; too bad.

Can you please support this statement? To what do you reference?