why do we continue to do cpr????

[MSBMEDIC]

there are a few questions that are being asked these days on and about cpr. questions that are starting to make people worried, like american heart assoc.. companys that make lots of money promoting these procedures through schooling, books, materials, and govt. handouts. why are these questions being asked and by whom?. this is a simple answer, its us, the emt/medics. the reason is simple as well, its because CPR does'nt revive people who are pulseless and non-breathing and never has.

now before you become angry and start to scream and think of cuting my manhood off with old trama shears let me point out to you people the stats. on cpr revival. first those few pts. that we get that are in cardiac arrest due to drownings, cold exposure, children, and new borns lets leave out of the equation.

CPR success rates are only one tenth of one percent and of pts who are found pulseless and non-breathing only 1 percent of that rate walk out of the hosp without major brain injuries resulting in being on vents, severe disibilitys and living in a n.h. for a few years with severe complications.

we all know of these figures but continue to perform cpr, why? and why do we get on scene find a full coded pt. whose been down for several mins. at least if not 15-20 and still told to perform cpr?.

its simple, these people who want us to continue this make alot of moola!, knowing cpr is worhtless and doesnt revive the pulseless and non-breathing.

the AHA is a large so-called not for profit organization, but these people make millions of dollars every year by selling books, recert cpr cards and receiving grants/funding from govt.( ie, you& i) and all they simply say is "WE NEED CPR", but have yet to prove that it is effective on a pulseless and non-breathing human.

in my opion cpr should be done away with for every pt. ( except those i mentioned ), if you arrive on scene and find a pulseless non-breathing pt. you do your normal checks ( breath sounsd, pulse, monitor in all leads) and if they are in assytole you simply call it what it is a dead person who went to be with the lord.

the statistics are out there you just have to bring it to your med director, insurance people, and politicians so we can get this to stop us from waisting our valuable time and go to prevention mode, education. think of this, many people believe they will be reseuated when they become pulseless and non-breathing but give them the statistics and they will be surprised and may seek overall prevenative care and not want you to attempt to rescue them from visiting the lord. (i'm not a conspiracy theroist)

[Chief1C]

I'm not a religious person, I think that when you die.. We can't just keep you, and people feel the need to mourn, have some closure. So, they fill your body with toxins, so the rotting and putrefaction process is slowed down, and then seal you in a vault that turns you into stew.. and that's that. I don't believe in God, I don't believe in Heaven. I think accidents happen, and people die because the human body is what it is; and it can't survive being torn apart, crushed or aged beyond what you have done to it. You can't fix a lifetime of bad decisions and habits, with all the modern medicine thrown together. You're born, if you're lucky to escape injury or illness, you live, and then you die. That's how it works.

Why do healthy people die? I don't know.. I didn't go to medical school.. and I don't want to. People die. It happens, all the time. Sometimes, they're not dead, there was just a blurp in whatever causes time, our bodies, etc.. to work.. and they can reverse it. It happens a lot. People are resuscitated all the time. I've done JUST CPR on people.. and the heart beat returned.. and they began to breathe again.. and they lived many more years. How did it work? I don't know.. It just happened. Do I want to know how it works? No. Because someone will say that God did it.. No.. It's my back that hurts, from doing CPR.. Not God's.. God didn't learn CPR. If we revive someone.. and they leave the hospital. Medicine did it. If they die.. Someone will blame medicine, but I'd be comfortable enough, for you to go ahead and blame God. The term, God, gets too much credit for what medicine can do.

I like to think that, unless you're obviously dead... You might appreciate the possibility of being proven wrong, sorry, you weren't completely dead.. Oops. You should have had a DNR pinned to your chest. Maybe a DNR card, attached to a nipple ring? No? It was worth a shot.

Then, when we bring them back, and they're a Veggie, we should be able to pull the plug. Yank it right out, and pretend we didn't try to bring you back.

I'm being a little sarcastic, but most of it is the result of absolutely no sleep.. and a lot of caffeine.

[ERDoc]

Wow. First, welcome to the city. Second, if you want to become a respected member here you will quickly learn that when you make assumptions/generalizations like these you need to back them up the facts. Evidence here mean finding a study to support your statements. "My instructor told me so," does not count as evidence based medicine.

While CPR sucess rate is dismal, there are still those who survive. The research is improving all the time. We are learning that things that we assumed in the past are wrong (stacked shocks anyone). With proper research and enough time I truly think we will see an improvement in morbidity and mortality. The reasons that you point out are exactly why we need to educate the public and first responders/PD on how to perform effective CPR. I am also a supporter of public access defibrillation, despite it's poor performance in the literature so far. I think if we refine the methodolgy, in time, we will get better results.

[letmesleep]

I'm being a little sarcastic, but most of it is the result of absolutely no sleep.. and a lot of caffeine.

WHO? You our the dead stew in the vault? LOL!

[Chief1C]

WHO? You our the dead stew in the vault? LOL!

Which ever you want.

[TDP]

there are a few questions that are being asked these days on and about cpr. questions that are starting to make people worried, like american heart assoc.. companys that make lots of money promoting these procedures through schooling, books, materials, and govt. handouts. why are these questions being asked and by whom?. this is a simple answer, its us, the emt/medics. the reason is simple as well, its because CPR does'nt revive people who are pulseless and non-breathing and never has.

now before you become angry and start to scream and think of cuting my manhood off with old trama shears let me point out to you people the stats. on cpr revival. first those few pts. that we get that are in cardiac arrest due to drownings, cold exposure, children, and new borns lets leave out of the equation.

CPR success rates are only one tenth of one percent and of pts who are found pulseless and non-breathing only 1 percent of that rate walk out of the hosp without major brain injuries resulting in being on vents, severe disibilitys and living in a n.h. for a few years with severe complications.

we all know of these figures but continue to perform cpr, why? and why do we get on scene find a full coded pt. whose been down for several mins. at least if not 15-20 and still told to perform cpr?.

its simple, these people who want us to continue this make alot of moola!, knowing cpr is worhtless and doesnt revive the pulseless and non-breathing.

the AHA is a large so-called not for profit organization, but these people make millions of dollars every year by selling books, recert cpr cards and receiving grants/funding from govt.( ie, you& i) and all they simply say is "WE NEED CPR", but have yet to prove that it is effective on a pulseless and non-breathing human.

in my opion cpr should be done away with for every pt. ( except those i mentioned ), if you arrive on scene and find a pulseless non-breathing pt. you do your normal checks ( breath sounsd, pulse, monitor in all leads) and if they are in assytole you simply call it what it is a dead person who went to be with the lord.

the statistics are out there you just have to bring it to your med director, insurance people, and politicians so we can get this to stop us from waisting our valuable time and go to prevention mode, education. think of this, many people believe they will be reseuated when they become pulseless and non-breathing but give them the statistics and they will be surprised and may seek overall prevenative care and not want you to attempt to rescue them from visiting the lord. (i'm not a conspiracy theroist)

CONTENT REMOVED - ADMIN

I have had to re-read your statments if thats what you call them 2 and 3 times to understand what you were trying to say,or atleast attempt. Before you can make statements such as this ;

the AHA is a large so-called not for profit organization, but these people make millions of dollars every year by selling books, recert cpr cards and receiving grants/funding from govt.( ie, you& i) and all they simply say is "WE NEED CPR", but have yet to prove that it is effective on a pulseless and non-breathing human.

read this:

AHA CIRC STATS

In house survival rates

Like stated above,before you go out and make such statement,you need to have clinical evidence,before making such a statment. If you would like more information,PM ME. I have enough journals and articles to keep you busy for a solid 5 years.

regards,

[itku2er]

MSB the simple fact is this,,,,, doesn't every patient deserve a chance to have any procedure done no matter what the provider thinks?

Lifesaving isnt an extact science if it were the morticians would be out of business. Good post TDP I was looking through the AHA instructor page to find some stats.

MSB where are you at, I want to move all my family from there cause who knows you might be "not wanting to do CPR on one of them"

[mshow00]

.

I like to think that, unless you're obviously dead... You might appreciate the possibility of being proven wrong, sorry, you weren't completely dead..

The Princess Bride] Lucky for your friend he is not completely dead... just mostly dead...

I, unlike 4cmk6(all respect meant), belive in God; at least enough to know that I am not him/her. I do wish we could find the perfect algorithm, that would bring about a 99% success rate (lets face it logically not everyone can be saved). The only I am saying is I never want to be in the place where I have no issue "playing God". No MCI's don't count; I do know that I will have to make some "you live you die" decisions in my career (still very young and very green), but I don't want to start making those decisions arbitrarily in my every day to day actions. (saying stuff like very fine v-fib is asystole with artifact, just so I don't have to work the code)

[sirduke]

My only gripe is the families that are screaming "Save Mama" when you arrive, yet have refused to even attempt CPR. If you care about saving mama, take a damn CPR class and learn how to correctly preform CPR.

I went to one call where the 30 something year old son had a toilet plunger pumping up and down on dad's chest. He'd heard about it on the radio.

I would agree that every patient deserves a chance, but there are times when you just know it is futile.

[pguy280]

Why i see the point on dead is dead. Being an instructor for AHA in CPR PALS an ACLS I am happy to teach these do to the fact that it may save some ones family member from the darkside. I am guessing you never had a pt that came back to see you after a save an thank you. I also have dealt in many cases where just going through the motions has provided the families with the knowledge that ever thing was done for there loved one.

Why the AHA does make money on all that you mentioned they also support many studies that provide us as providers with better options for survivability. They also sponsor many organizations with funding to provide the ability to teach the public proper methods of cpr and increase patient out comes.

I ask you one question would you like every thing done on you or a loved one in the event of sudden cardiac arrest. We here in mass have the option as providers to not resuscitate under our protocols. That is where the decision should be made not by individuals who don't believe in working certain cardiac arrest

Its to bad that its not a cut and dry option but that is life and every one deserves that chance at life. I am happy to give my dough to the AHA if it means that one persons walks out of the hospital. Thats what its about.

Brendan