Rig staffed with Medic and EMT

[JakeEMTP]

One last question from me on this topic: Would you rather have a fully trained moronic Paramedic partner or a knowledgeable albeit limited in skills EMT?

I'll take the medic partner thank you. Hopefully they won't be truly moronic as Paramedic classes ( note classes, not school) usually weeds them out. If it doesn't, it sucks.

Even if they are moronic, they bring more to the table that is beneficial to me then any knowledgeable basic.

[Just Plain Ruff]

3)The paramedic is left with the ALS parts of treatment while the basic handles the immediate life threats.

Huh??????

[JakeEMTP]

3)The paramedic is left with the ALS parts of treatment while the basic handles the immediate life threats.

Huh??????

:scratch:

[Just Plain Ruff]

:scratch:

I didn't know there was a difference.

[JakeEMTP]

There isn't Ruff. IT made me scratch my head too. :wink:

I guess I shouldn't have quoted your post. My Bad. I was agreeing with you.

[Just Plain Ruff]

no I was just scratching my head too. I thought that paramedics were taught to fix the immediate lifethreats as well as do ALS skills. I actually thought that they were one in the same.

That statement by the poster we are referring to is about as bad and absurd as paramedics save live and emt's save medics.

[Dustdevil]

One last question from me on this topic: Would you rather have a fully trained moronic Paramedic partner or a knowledgeable albeit limited in skills EMT?

It's an incredibly silly and pointless question. If the only comparison you can make is to a moron, you're not making a very convincing case for your basic.

To answer your question, I wouldn't hire either one.

And I'd take the greenest medic over the most experienced EMT anyday.

[mstovall]

Scar-I thought the first thing you did was take care of immediate life threats....the ABC's. You do this prior to taking a history or focused assessment. Wouldn't fixing all immediate life threats then start with a BLS procedure?

Skill-the ability to use one's knowledge effectively and readily in execution or performance. Webster

A monkey mimics, it does not use skill.

I agree with your description of a PP truck's relationship.

Dust-Man you must have some very inept B's around you. I hear where you are coming from, but the mixed trucks work good around hear. I hope your B's could do more than just braun work. We are expected on our trucks to start interventions. We start bagging a patient while the P gets their airway kit ready. We start compressions while the Defib is being readied (maybe only a handful of compressions, but witness DNR arrests at the local teaching hospital has shown that it takes 6 seconds of compressions to get the BP up to facilitate perfusion). We set up lines, put on the O2, and can even help P's find veins on the other arm.

While I will agree that a PP truck would be more effective, a good team of PB can handle just about anything.

The best thing I think a PP truck has to offer is a mentor relationship for new medics to hone their skills.

We are short in our area for paramedics. There is only one service in a 45 mile radius that I know has a fully staffed medic service. That is an area to include 16 services that handle emergency calls. If you have all the medics you can use, then PP trucks are the way to go.

The pro's I listed were what I see in my service. While there are drawbacks that you listed, these are the advantages that we have with an PB truck over a BLS only truck. I was trying to answer the question that was originally posted for the pros of a truck that is PB.

I can open an airway..............a BLS skill that should be utilized.

I can place a simple adjunct....a BLS skill that should be utilized.

I can perform chest compressions..........a BLS skill that should be utilized.

I can check to see if a person is breathing..........BLS skill.

I can control bleeding........BLS skill.

These immediate life threats can be taken care of by a B while the medic is getting a line started, getting an airway kit out, reading an ECG strip that might be a little tricky ( I have even seen MD's measure out a strip on some borderline strips), get the narc box out, get drugs primed and ready, etc.

I never said that a BP truck was better than a PP truck, but the question was posed as what are some advantages of having a PB truck.

The tunnel vision many have in their responses on this board sometimes cause the original question to be left unanswered.

Before crapping on someone's response in the future, we should all read the original post and see if the person being crapped on is answering the original post. That may alleviate some of the arrogant attitudes that hinder the original points from being answered. Course then we might have a broader spectrum of ideas floating around which may minimize the self-proclaimed superiority of certain individuals on this board.

JMHO,

Michael

[Dustdevil]

Micheal, you are completely missing the point. It doesn't matter one iota how awesome or inept a basic is. He's still just a helper and not a partner. He still forces me to assume complete responsibility for every patient, without ever getting a break. Worse yet, he forces me to assume responsibility for his performance, as well as my own. There is nothing of significant value that he brings to the table with his 120 hours of training. In fact, he adds more work than he performs.

You're still just basically saying, "EMTs are better than nothing", which isn't a very glowing endorsement.

What I need is a PARTNER, not a helper. The difference it makes on how quickly I, or any other medic, burns out is incredible. Basic partners is one significant contributor to paramedic turnover, resulting in the unstable workforce that results in our remaining low-wage, blue-collar labourers instead of medical professionals. You can't have a profession and have 3-week night school labourers too. You have to choose which one you want. But if you choose to staff your EMS with EMTs, then I don't want to hear you whining about low wages and no respect, because you are the reason why.

[EMTrocker]

Micheal, you are completely missing the point. It doesn't matter one iota how awesome or inept a basic is. He's still just a helper and not a partner. He still forces me to assume complete responsibility for every patient, without ever getting a break. Worse yet, he forces me to assume responsibility for his performance, as well as my own. There is nothing of significant value that he brings to the table with his 120 hours of training. In fact, he adds more work than he performs.

You're still just basically saying, "EMTs are better than nothing", which isn't a very glowing endorsement.

What I need is a PARTNER, not a helper. The difference it makes on how quickly I, or any other medic, burns out is incredible. Basic partners is one significant contributor to paramedic turnover, resulting in the unstable workforce that results in our remaining low-wage, blue-collar labourers instead of medical professionals. You can't have a profession and have 3-week night school labourers too. You have to choose which one you want. But if you choose to staff your EMS with EMTs, then I don't want to hear you whining about low wages and no respect, because you are the reason why.

Well said!