Ideas About These News Stories

[Kaisu]

What does everyone thing out AMR hitting the arrived button when they are miles away?

Absolutely not true. AMR has AVL (the eye in the sky) and they know exactly where the ambulance is at all times. Secondly, AMR has 15 minute scene time standard. If the ambulance is on scene for longer than that, they have to fill out paper work stating why and the call is looked at. If anything, there is incentive for crews to go on scene later rather than earlier (to avoid paperwork). With a standard that has to be met for response and another one for on scene time, the total time to scene and on scene washes any possible shenanigans.

[Dustdevil]

Here is vegas, FD arrives first 2/3 of the time and private ambulance 1/3 of the time. I think FD has a vaild point and the news uncovered that the private ambulance companies are cheating on dispatching the calls. I know out here in Vegas, when you need a paramedic, you depend of FD not AMR or Medicwest

Did you read anything I wrote in my first post? The FD is then reason that EMS is stretched too thin. When they are the cause of the problem, it's pretty absurd to believe they have a valid point.

[BushyFromOz]

I love the way some people are up this MEdic West and AMR crowd for meeting their contractual obligations? I mean, wheres the sense in that?

Perhaps you should be turning your outrage against the city for having what you may find to be substandard targets?

Or better yet, get the bucket fairies out of ambulance and use thatmoney to pay for more services and a superior contract?

You cant have it both ways.

[CostantinoA]

With CCFD, they always send FD with ambulances so I am not sure what you are refering to on your first post. This story was about CCFD not LVFD or HDFD. If CCFD can arrive in mins, why cant AMR. Why is AMR pusing the arrived button when GPS is showing them miles away. That is the point I am getting at.

Did you read anything I wrote in my first post? The FD is then reason that EMS is stretched too thin. When they are the cause of the problem, it's pretty absurd to believe they have a valid point.

[ERDoc]

With CCFD, they always send FD with ambulances so I am not sure what you are refering to on your first post. This story was about CCFD not LVFD or HDFD. If CCFD can arrive in mins, why cant AMR. Why is AMR pusing the arrived button when GPS is showing them miles away. That is the point I am getting at.

I think what Dust was say is that there is no reason for FD to respond. They can get FFs on-scene so quickly because they are sitting around doing nothing. Get rid of some of the FFs and hire real medics to staff ambulances and you can solve your problem with little effect on costs (might even be able to save a few bucks because you know they aren't going to pay Medics the same as the FFs). If AMR is meeting it's contractual obligations, there is nothing anyone can say about it. If people are not happy with the service, blame the city not the EMS service. If the city wants better service, negotiate a new contract. As for pushing the button before actually being on scene, I can't speak to that since I have a one sided arguement from a biased source. If it is true, it's a pretty crappy thing to do and should be punished in some form.

[Dustdevil]

I think what Dust was say is that there is no reason for FD to respond. They can get FFs on-scene so quickly because they are sitting around doing nothing. Get rid of some of the FFs and hire real medics to staff ambulances and you can solve your problem with little effect on costs (might even be able to save a few bucks because you know they aren't going to pay Medics the same as the FFs).

^ This.

Again, why would anyone spend EMS funds on people who cannot provide EMS, and then blame someone else for the problem they have created? It boggles the mind how idiotic that is. But the really scary thing is that they're not doing it out of idiocy. They're doing it out of selfish dishonesty.

America's heroes, my arse.

[Just Plain Ruff]

Here is vegas, FD arrives first 2/3 of the time and private ambulance 1/3 of the time. I think FD has a vaild point and the news uncovered that the private ambulance companies are cheating on dispatching the calls. I know out here in Vegas, when you need a paramedic, you depend of FD not AMR or Medicwest

So how many of the ambulances that AMR has on the streets are pulling non-emergent patient transfers?

If you have 20 ambulances in Vegas on at one time. Let's say 4-5 are on non-emergency transfers.

Now you look at how many fire trucks or units the fire department has on duty and since they don't run non-emergency transfers, there is no wonder why they beat the ambulance 2/3 of the time.

Case in point - When I worked in Independence MO. AMR had 6 ambulances on duty. Indep Fire had 10 pumpers, 2 trucks and 2 rescue trucks, all of which could run EMS calls.

OF those 6 ambulances, at least 2 were on transfers most of the time. So a total of 4 ambulances to cover 110K people and many square miles. is it a wonder why the fire trucks beat the ambulances 2/3 or more of the time?

It's simple math on this.

[ERDoc]

You have to love the propaganda machine that keeps saying that when an ambulance is called, second matter. Really? In what percent of calls does the few minutes difference between when the FD gets there and EMS gets there does it mean anything? I'd say probably less than 1%.

[Just Plain Ruff]

You have to love the propaganda machine that keeps saying that when an ambulance is called, second matter. Really? In what percent of calls does the few minutes difference between when the FD gets there and EMS gets there does it mean anything? I'd say probably less than 1%.

I've been on only a couple of calls where seconds counted. I can point out a couple of instances.

1. Patient with chest pain, codes with us 1 minute out. Shocked him and got him back, he walked out of the hospital 4 days later.

2. Arm caught in Auger, nearly ripped off, massive bleeding. No-one on scene to apply direct pressure. We arrived on scene to apply the pressure and stop the bleeding until we got him to the ER. Patient lost about 30% of his blood volume. Patient survived to discharge. Many problems during hospital stay but really if it took us any longer to get there he would have died.

Those are two of the calls that I remember in my 18 year career in EMS that seconds counted. I can think of just a handful or two that seconds truly counted.

But you know what is the issue on the seconds count mantra - EMS Agencies are some of the biggest propagators of this myth.

[Dustdevil]

You have to love the propaganda machine that keeps saying that when an ambulance is called, second matter. Really? In what percent of calls does the few minutes difference between when the FD gets there and EMS gets there does it mean anything? I'd say probably less than 1%.

Of course, even if it were 100 percent of the time, then that would only reiterate the need to pay for more ambulances, and not more first responders. Morons.