dzmohr

Just realized I never answered the question. I have a BLS jump kit I put together I carry in the car. I run a nonprofit that helps do fund raising for PAD programs that could not otherwise afford them and a for profit company that sells them to those that can afford them.. so I carry an AED in my car ( sometimes a few of them) --- if I did not sell them or demo them to prospective clients I doubt I would carry it unless I was with a formal vol agency where it was protocol to respond POV. I do not hesitate to stop to assist if there is chance my help could be needed, and it is safe for me to do so... but I don't make big deal of it. Now in my office that is another story ... I miss the street ...BADLY! And I have collected a mini museum of "stuff" I even got a first generation Thumper ( mechanical CPR machine for those of you who have not heard of them) for 50 bucks on eBay ( works perfectly!, a life pak 3 and a life pak 5. I even bought one of the first ambulance types I worked out of but later sold it...have thought about buying another if I find the right one ( was a hearse that converted to an ambulance, GREAT and REALLY fast cadillac with a HUGE engine!)... none of this for the street, they are my toys.

At one point a good friend who was rather well off and an ER Doc offered to pay my way thru med school ( was making 1.65/hr got paid for 13 of the 24 hours we were on duty cause the State said they did not have to pay for the 8 hours sleep time and 3 hour meal time we rarely got)... while it was tempting financially I have a number of Drs who were friends and I did not want the BS that THEY had to deal with either ...I took a pass and was never sorry. Continued in the field another 25 years after that. On the other hand, as I posted in another thread a little while ago, ... I have dreamed and still wish that we would have evolved into PAs and NPs specializing in prehospital care. That would open up some AMAZING possibilities I think, including financially viable exit strategy when it was time to leave the street.

I suppose I should do a search and see if this has been discussed already, I suspect it has.... maybe should even be in it's own thread, but I am being lazy tonight, but what is your vision of the paramedic of the future? Considering the nursing shortage, crisis of ER overcrowding, the pandemic of the month on the horizon and who knows what other scare tactics await us..I have always thought/wished the paramedic of the future would be a PA or NP specializing in prehospital care. Pt has saturable laceration, we suture, write for pain and antibiotics and clear, no transport. Between calls we could do public health checks, immunizations, and such. We would have professional standing ( even being able to bill for services ourselves), and it wold relieve the crunch at the ER and there would be a career path for medics that needed to or chose to leave the street. Dream a little, I am not asking if politically it could happen, I am asking what direction it would go in if you were King.

It happens! Basic as it sounds... I ended up doing 18 minutes of one man CPR in a department store 3 blocks from Portland Engine 13 and ALS Rescue 2 and I sent someone to call 911 and wait for them....only thing is it appears he never called, nor did anybody else...this a bit before cell phones were more prevalent then purses and wallets... good reminder. This thread has saddened me a bit ( though I did get a GREAT laugh from Timmy and Supermedics joke post)... when did it get to the point that a care giver would drive past a witnessed medical or trauma with nobody else on scene yet and not stop? I can not even IMAGINE doing that, unless it was not safe for me to stop and a few times when I have had my small kids with me alone and it would not have been safe for THEM to have me stop. I am not talking about scanner responding three cities away, I am talking about randomly coming across an incident before local responders arrive. I don't consider myself paranoid post 9/11but with the increase in disasters we have seen internationally, even since long before that it just made SENSE that everybody should have some level of preparedness. Granted when I was young I was in the middle of the Sylmar earthquake, but many that have said they carry nothing and would not stop live in tornado, flood or hurricane country. How could you NOT carry anything, even if for your families protection? Guess I am getting old and times have changed ... but I can NOT say for the better if this is TRULY the attitude of the majority. As to a law that requires some to stop, I will check and see if it is STILL the law, but New Hampshire use to have a law that anyone with medical training was required to render aid if they knew such aid was required... my recollection was it was part of the vehicle code and related to traffic accidents. Several States have laws that if you are involved in an accident and some say even if you witness an accident you must stop and render aid as you are able. Disclaimer: I have not researched this for like 10 years so it is possible those laws could have changed, but I will be checking to see if anyone wants to know what I find out PM me or post the request here.

Nothing nefarious that I could see or read into this post, we assume everyone knows this cause we are in the business, they don't! I thought a great job was done showing it is a TEAM effort, nobody more important then the other, each with a role on the team. That this was on YouTube gave it even more exposure, now I want to go back and see how many times it was viewed... Thanks for the post Bushy

Good point! The Judge can decide any way he wants to, but the specific verbiage of every Good Sam law I have seen ( 20-25 States and Federal) have language to the effect of "without the expectation of remuneration" or " without anticipating remuneration." While a Judge would have the power to rule the 50 dollar gift certificate your City gave you as part of a citation for bravery in a Good Sam off duty case would be remuneration he would most likely have a problem on appeal explaining how there was an expectation or anticipation when the care was rendered as opposed to an unanticipated, unexpected gift after the fact. Now if you ASKED for a flight voucher,or a drink related to the provision of care you would not be an employee of the airline, but you WOULD be anticipating or expecting remuneration. In my mind the relevant reason for not accepting the drink or voucher would be ethics, not legal liability.

I usually do not identify myself..however, if I notice in boarding someone that makes me wonder if they are healthy enough to be flying or if I notice something that makes me think someone is ill and may need assistance then I will usually mention to a flight attendant that I am a retired medic and if there is anything I can do to assist I will be happy to. They usually thank me again for offering on disembarking. I never considered it posing or a big deal, just offering if I felt it was possibly needed. Have been used a few times, have not had to do anything ALS yet, often wondered what I would do since I am not currently certified I think I would have to make that call based on the circumstances at the time. I would certainly waive for someone who is certified or licensed and just assist. I specifically have not asked what my legal position is cause I think I might know the answer and I do not want to know that...ignorance is bliss and all... I have never been offered a drink or flight perks for helping but, with all due respect, I disagree that it would blow my good samaritan coverage unless I asked for the perks. I can't say I am familiar with the good sa laws in each of the 50 States, but I am familiar with at least half of them and I have yet to see one that would disqualify me unless I sought remuneration. That being said I would have an ethical problem with acepting the perks, but not a legal fear. Did the attorney give you a specific cite for his statement? I would love to look up the law for the State he is in, perhaps it is worded to preclude accepting unsolicited awards, scholarships, or anything tangible. I have gotten a few free meals at Red Cross "heros" breakfasts, no worries for me there either. I am not challenging here, just looking to learn something new....

This same question was asked of me when I was helping Sacramento start their ALS system in the early 80s. This was one of our skills as a paramedic and I had done several over the years but in Sacramento, till the clock it the right mark, even those certified as medics in other counties could only work as Is in Sacramento ... so we, who would precept the first medics, were grilled heavily on if we would violate I scope of practice if it came down to it. They did not like my answer but I got the job anyway.... this was my thinking process to answer... 1. Could the patient survive to the ER, in this case the answer was no 2. Would the patient likely live if I did the procedure .. in this case the answer is yes 3. Would the patient likely die without it ... again, as in one the answer is yes 4. Is it worth my career? We all put our LIVES on the line for patients or even POSSIBLE patients on a near daily basis. It surprises me how many would not put a JOB on the line... I am not referring to ANY of the previous posts in this thread, just the feeling in general ... those that most boldly will risk their lives will often take the easy way out if their job is on the line. That being said ....there are so many variables and just as we may reason it is too dangerous to do a rescue we ay decide the risk/benefit of doing this procedure is too high. If we are not familiar with the procedure and do not have the equipment to do it ( in this case most of us would) I can see refusing the order. I did throw them one curve they did not count on, when I asked where the call was they told me and I said I would reroute so we hit the tip of Butte County where I was paramedic and could legally do the skill then continue to Sac as it would not significantly change the ETA. We have to consider many of us have families that depend on us keeping our source of income ... In any event I would not be critical of one who refused the order but I would totally have the back of anyone who complied with it and had to go to the wall.

I know this is an old thread, but it is new to me... I teach ARC for them as they lack field experienced instructors, I teach AHA when I teach facility based classes but for general public classes I very much perfer Medic First Aid out of Eugene, OR but with training centers internationally. I find them more student friendly and field oriented..

There are grants for just about anything if you are creative enough and know where to look and your timing is perfect... can't say I know of a specific "grant" for personal AEDs. Several of the online AED sales folks offer "grants" that are really just sale prices on their stock... That being said I am a distributor for 5 brands of AEDs and if I know it is for a volunteer responder who is buying out of pocket I will cut pretty deep. I have sold new AEDs I have been able to dovetail onto a large sale and been able to sell for as little as 600. Even if I don't have anything with that volume I can hook into I can get one's and two's for 750.00 Keep in mind this is my business and livelyhood though so I can't offer everyone that price...but I do anything I can to help.... another possibility is watch for AEDs that are being replaced with upgrade units...you can pick up monophasic and 2002 standard units pretty cheap. I have been able to donate a number of them to folks that would otherwise have to go without and are at risk. Heart Association ECC and Red Cross have stated the technology is not SO different that the old units need to be scrapped and I would NEVER put one in line service where there was ANY possibility of getting a biphasic 2005 standard unit placed. Send me an email or call e toll free at (800) 646-4392 and let me know what your circumstances are and I will do my VERY best to help.

This is what I am looking for... not how WE teach classes, not even so much how OUR students react. I would like to think that we who have done CPR and who know and can impart to our students what to expect - do exactly as portrayed here. Unfortunately among the "we" group of instructors I was talking about when I started this thread, EMS experienced instructors are the minority. By far most who take CPR classes, as has been noted in several threads here and elsewhere, are taught by instructors who have never seen a dead body let alone tried to resuscitate one. They are the instructors of the 7 of 10 I mentioned in my informal polling, study, whatever you want to call it. Also, as Geezlaweezy noted, after our post resuscitation by a minimum of 30 days interview MOST who had said they would not do it again reversed and many retrained as was his experience. I think he demonstrates well what I feel is needed but have no proof....I think someone in EMS should followup with anyone who has assisted with lay bystander CPR to offer any followup assistance they may ( or may not) need. I am happy that some of you have NEVER had a patent's family who had a bad experience. I to have been in the field for a while ( since 1971) and my experience is quite different. Of course most express happiness that they did SOMETHING as opposed to nothing, and of course those taught by EMS instructors fared better then those instructed by those who left them unprepared. Evidently I am not the ONLY one who has noticed that some, without being able to have someone who has "been there" to talk to about it, do not fare so well. With all due respect, is it possible, those who have "never seen a problem" have not had much exposure to family members 30+ days post code in an unsuccessful resuscitation. With the adrenaline pumping and hope at a high, dealing with immediate grief is it POSSIBLE more of your patient families who performed bystander CPR trained by other lay instructors inexperienced with resuscitation in the real world have problems that you do not know about. I admit it is possible that I am the only one or one of the few but I think not. By the way, I teach my students right too, I would appreciate it if we could back off the personal attacks and ridicule a bit and talk about the issue which in THIS thread I hope I have some say in --- yes I teach reality based CPR, no I am not an academic only instructor I have been on the street 30+ years too and I am NOT an idiot, but thanks for treating me as one, it is a very nice welcome indeed! Nice to see it is still a cannibalistic mentality when it comes to discussing issues. (Geezlaweezy this last part is NOT directed at you --- rather at the paragods with the 80 years of experience who think everyone is an idiot especially if they do not have the right letters after their name--- more especially if there are no Ps or RNs included ) If I am taking my welcome wrong I tender my apology now, but I note you guys play rough as I have been reading other threads! I miss the early days when we helped and collaborated with each other as we ALL learned from each other. WAY back before we knew EVERYTHING.

I use the term "CISD" generically--- I am not looking to debate the content of our classes nor the value or content of CISD---I am trying to find out if other perceive a concern for the psycho-social issues involved in a lay bystander doing CPR and losing a loved one and not getting any followup counseling, feedback or a chance to deal with his thoughts and if so what others are doing about it, if anything.

Maryland EMS ships are also State Police patrol units that are almost always in the air. It is quite likely they dropped them off on the way to base. It would not be unusual to fly them in as a professional courtesy.

I have not been able to find a topic that comes close to a research project I am thinking about doing. I wanted to get some of your thoughts on this. I have not been able to find a study that addresses this in my search either.... We tell people "come take a CPR class and learn to save a life." We do NOT tell them 85-92% will not make it, but CPR gives them the only chance they have. We tell people practice and get the compressions right, if you do it wrong you will break bones... we do NOT tell them the sternum was not designed to be pushed down that far and you will may well break cartilage or bones even if you do it right... So when their patient, usually a family member, does not make it, my experience is many feel they "killed" their loved one. They forget they were told the person has to be sick or hurt enough to die to qualify for CPR to begin with. If we, as professionals, respond to a family member who is critical most of us will get a CISD response. I have found few departments or agencies that track after effects of bystander CPR on the lay provider. A few have chaplains that may or may not be called but at best most will just get a card from the Red Cross or AHA saying thanks for being a hero and trying. I have done a very unscientific and informal study and found that 7 out of 10 with negative outcomes say they would never do CPR again. Is anyone aware of a study or do any of you have policies that address this? I will be most interested in your comments.

Several posted here last year about the ResQPod and suction cup CPR - Whatcom County and the Twin Cities were doing studies, any update? The ResQPod was a hit at the Citizen CPR conference in Florida a few weeks ago and is touted in this month's JEMS....how are they working in the field?