This mindset HAS to change, and change soon !

[fireflymedic]

I just got done speaking with someone that I knew several years ago that got into EMS from the fire side. Now let me start off by saying, this isn't a fire or basic bashing thread, but simply venting some frustration from a situation that I'm seeing over and over. My state recently enacted a program to push all EMS workers to go through an accredited program after Jan 1st, 2009. If they weren't graduates of an accredited program or grandfathered in then they were just out of luck. Grandfathering will be adopted for all current EMS workers. Well I asked if he planned on pursuing his medic and his exact words were, "hell no why should I? I can get paid 11.41 an hour for three months worth the school as a basic. I don't see the benefit." He also later stated he had no plans to continue a career in EMS (mind you he works for a local shuttle service, non 911). Also claimed that moving towards an accredited program with instructors being required to have degrees was ludacris and would serve no benefit to EMS personnel.

We claim we want things better, better pay, benefits, equipment, whatever yet we constantly prove over and over again that we are our own worst enemies here. A sacrifice has to be made somewhere to get what we want but everyone is wanting something for nothing and people, hate to break it to ya, but it just don't work that way ! Perhaps the upgrade will reduce people coming into the field with this bull headed mentality. Sorry to go off on here, but I'm just tired of hearing the same old story every day but then when proposing plans to change things people are resistant 'cause "that's how it's always been". Dang it that excuse don't work anymore ! If that excuse worked, then why do we bother changing protocols and doing any sort of research? Let's just keep repeating our failures and never move forward. Yeah, that's how we'll get recognized as a profession !

[DwayneEMTP]

The problem is that you're talking two different issues.

You speak of firemen in the same conversation that you mention medicine, professionalism and education.

Fire is not involved in paramedic medicine. They are leeches that need to ride the back of EMS to continue to justify their needlessly bloated budgets.

When we speak of continued, and increased education we can not realistically do so with Fire as part of the solution as the fire unions have proven for two generations now that they don't want the medicine. They only want the money.

Speaking of Fire when you speak about "us" is akin to speaking of Vtach as part of hemodynamic stability. You only reference it in regards to its pathologic affect on the system.

I'm having a hard time imagining a world in which fire is not going to come to control EMS in the U.S. Perhaps it's better that we just give it to them, take the 25yr step back in time, so that we can at least begin the maturing process necessary to produce the EMS system and standards that we all know are possible.

Dwayne

[cprems]

ORANGE ORANGE ORANGE........You know you love "US" really.

The problem is that you're talking two different issues.

You speak of firemen in the same conversation that you mention medicine, professionalism and education.

Fire is not involved in paramedic medicine. They are leeches that need to ride the back of EMS to continue to justify their needlessly bloated budgets.

When we speak of continued, and increased education we can not realistically do so with Fire as part of the solution as the fire unions have proven for two generations now that they don't want the medicine. They only want the money.

Speaking of Fire when you speak about "us" is akin to speaking of Vtach as part of hemodynamic stability. You only reference it in regards to its pathologic affect on the system.

I'm having a hard time imagining a world in which fire is not going to come to control EMS in the U.S. Perhaps it's better that we just give it to them, take the 25yr step back in time, so that we can at least begin the maturing process necessary to produce the EMS system and standards that we all know are possible.

Dwayne

[sirduke]

Getting the teeth of the Fire Depts out of EMS's throat is one step that has to happen. Then the next step is getting a National Standard, and I'm not talking NREMT, but a national standard like nursing and physicans have, of training and requirements.

With that in place, then we can progress towards becoming a real proffession.

Higher education standards are a must, and I for one, can't understand why someone would refuse to continue to gain education.

I guess they aren't really interested in patient care, but merely in this for a check.

[cprems]

The brunt of the problem is all these EMT "mills" around the country. As for the pay check, I was working for $10 a hour as a paramedic before going Offshore and making an actual living. If companies and employer's are willing to $10-15 hr for a warm body, the standards in the US will continue to be stagnant. Having said that I truly believe that ALL EMS in the US should be standardized, and NOT through the NREMT. We need greater education, but with that educations should come equal pay. Our local trash guy was making more than I was.

Ian.

Getting the teeth of the Fire Depts out of EMS's throat is one step that has to happen. Then the next step is getting a National Standard, and I'm not talking NREMT, but a national standard like nursing and physicans have, of training and requirements.

With that in place, then we can progress towards becoming a real proffession.

Higher education standards are a must, and I for one, can't understand why someone would refuse to continue to gain education.

I guess they aren't really interested in patient care, but merely in this for a check.

[Ridryder 911]

Getting the teeth of the Fire Depts out of EMS's throat is one step that has to happen. Then the next step is getting a National Standard, and I'm not talking NREMT, but a national standard like nursing and physicans have, of training and requirements.

With that in place, then we can progress towards becoming a real proffession.

Higher education standards are a must, and I for one, can't understand why someone would refuse to continue to gain education.

I guess they aren't really interested in patient care, but merely in this for a check.

Hence, part of the problem in EMS even of those in EMS education. Majority are not properly educated in EMS nor have a real understanding of the system or the educational standards that are in place, currently in the works or being considered. Do you realize the new curriculum has been in the works for the past 13 years? That it usually takes at the least 5-10 years to change any type of National changes? As well that NREMT has NO standards for EMS nor have they ever or ever will. It is a testing agency that supports and promotes EMS, and it uses the NHTSA EMS curriculum's to test by.

Although it sparks interest on the forum, other than that it is just yapping. Placing polls even discussing is easy, but really how many here are really and truly interested in change? .. How do you do this? By being involved in Federal and National changes that will be introduced to the State level. How many are actively involved in NAEMSE? Realize that they are now the ones making the changes in the standards? How many are aware of the required "transitional courses" that will be required beginning next year?

How many are involved in State EMS projects, State and Federal legislation, member of EMS Advocates, even the NAEMT?

Again, sure discussing is interesting and may spark fire, but again how many here have the credentials (education level) to be taken seriously on recommendations?

R/r 911