Asysin2leads Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 The story is here. The synopsis is that a nurse decided that someone wasn't dying fast enough and gave them a dose of a paralytic to help them along. Now, aside from the questions this raises, I think that it brings about a far more practical question. Generally speaking, in most EMS systems and hospitals, there are stringent efforts to control and maintain the administration and use of narcotics, such as morphine and benzodiazapines. However, other drugs, such as paralytics and even some sedative hypnotics, such as etomidate, are not held to the same standards of accountability. Do you think that there should be greater accountability and tracking for drugs such as paralytics? I'm a big fan of it, I have had to fall back on a paper trail many times when the feces hits the fan, but I know many people do not like having to fill out a form or play with the Pyxis everytime they want to give a drug. What is your opinion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ladybear Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 Wow! How friggin scarey.. glad I have never gotten that mentality! When it's time for someone to go that will happen when it's their time.. it's not my decision. It's even worse to know that I know some nurses who would think like that...{{SHUDDER}} :scratch: Most hospitals I've worked at have the drugs that you are discussing either locked in the Pixus or otherwise have to be obtained from the pharmacy. This does lead to a paper trail. The pharmacies are starting to check every chart, every day for un-prescribed medications being given, including normal saline at some hospitals. I've gotten pretty good at making sure the doctors write their verbal orders down or sign off on them before the patient is transfered, discharged, or otherwise dispo'd. I worked too hard to get my license to lose it because of someone else. I've also signed off on wasting narcotics for the medics when they give partial doses... I like that it covers their butts and I watch them waste the narcotics, covering mine. :bootyshake: LB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridryder 911 Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 The only place I did not have to account paralytics was for a flight service where I had a case of Sux. I thought it was dangerous, so as Chief Flight Nurse, I instituted a count policy on such type of med.'s (we had other type of RSI, paralytics). Even though not legally mandated, it was a safety factor to help prevent any missing or wrong doing. R/r 911 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brentoli Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 As advandced and computerized as everything is getting, how impractical is it to put everything in the pyxis? I am surprised there isn't a system for 'bolances out there. Or is there and I haven't seen it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridryder 911 Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 As advandced and computerized as everything is getting, how impractical is it to put everything in the pyxis? I am surprised there isn't a system for 'bolances out there. Or is there and I haven't seen it? Pyxis is not without problems. One can override as it just a computer that counts. The other thing pyxis are extremely expensive (yes thousands of dollars) for a few med.s? I much rather be held for accountability and take the money. R/r 911 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scratrat Posted September 21, 2008 Share Posted September 21, 2008 Every place I've worked at has had accountability for all drugs like that. Narcs, sux, etomidate, vec. And down south where I acquired phenergan, we even have to sign for it. For obvious reasons. But everything is lock tabbed and accounted for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VentMedic Posted September 21, 2008 Share Posted September 21, 2008 If you want to get these meds for reasons that are less than desirable, you can even with safe guards in place. Addicted healthcare workers have mastered several systems. Efren Saldivar aka Glendale's Angel of Death, Respiratory Therapist, confessed to over 50 murders and was recently sentenced for 6 confirmed murders. There would have been more but the prosecutors got tired of digging up bodies. Efren's reason for killing the people; to lighten the work load. Now the California RCPs must take a 3 hour Ethics course each renewal on "One should not kill the patients". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VentMedic Posted September 22, 2008 Share Posted September 22, 2008 As I said, where there's a will, there's a way. http://www.ems1.com/managers-supervisors/a...amedic-licenses 2 former Neb. firefighters lose paramedic licenses The Associated Press September 21, 2008 LINCOLN, Neb. — Two former members of the Lincoln Fire Department who are charged with drug crimes have had their paramedic certificates suspended. Fire Chief Niles Ford says neither Mark Eberspacher nor John Massie works for the fire department, although he wouldn't say whether they resigned or were fired. The state Department of Health and Human Services suspended the men's paramedic certificates. The 54-year-old Eberspacher is charged with theft and possession of a controlled substance for allegedly stealing a dying woman's painkillers. The 28-year-old John Massie is charged with acquiring a controlled substance. He's accused of stealing morphine from an ambulance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freaknuggetz_chick Posted September 22, 2008 Share Posted September 22, 2008 interesting....... my new count sheets do not include my benzo's, as they're not controlled, only semi-controlled. but its been bugging me a bit. been thinking of taking the sheets (i have the master on my computer at work) and throwing them on, making it work for me. i think i would just feel better. its honestly not often i haul out the heavies (rural can be boring at times) but i need to ensure i feel comfortable with the maintainence of it since i'm also the supe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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