Ontario (PCP) Flight Providers: The good, the bad, and...

[NickMedic]

Proof? How about the SOA providers only transport pts who ORNGE doesn't think are critical. Basically they are a flying transfer service! No difference than a PTS in the GTA!! They never go to peoples houses and do primary assessments, they transfer pts from facility to facility! Their jobs more closely reflect a transfer service (albeit a regulated transfer service) then a 911 service! If you work SOA air, you will never go to the scene of an MVC, never provide primary care to a PT (VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY rare situation) will they go to a reserve to do a primary response when ORNGE or the preferred providers are unable due to weather/lack of availability. Not only that, if the PCPf is working with an ACPf, they will do ZERO decision making if for some RARE situation where a decision needs to be made about PT care! Ask a ACPf who works for a SOA provider, they will even tell you the job is a piece of cake!

I have many many friends who work in Northern services (SNEMS, James Bay ambulance) and they all say that the SOA only transport stable pts who have a very low risk of deterioration and have been stabilized by the local hospital before the transfer for a CT scan or some other test, then transferred back home! Ala, a transfer service! How can you develop good 911 Paramedic skills when you have ZERO experience doing actual calls!

[NickMedic]

and how can you be a good ALS provider when a person has zero BLS skills/experience!

As I have said before, I came out of school thinking that ALS is the best thing since sliced bread, but realized that to be a GOOD ALS provider, you need to have some experience doing actual 911 calls! Their is a reason why every school in the province except ONE requires experience before allowing you to do ALS training. Good luck though!

[akroeze]

Ok, so apparently your thoughts about me have clouded your response because half of it seemed to be directed specifically at me and not at all about the topic at hand. You said:

You don't want to work air, especially when you have less than a couple years of road experience. You will be a bad land medic. Seems like people out of school go to work air, then get the ACPf without ever working in a half busy service on land. Its ridiculous and shouldnt be allowed!

But now apparently you are limiting it to everything BUT ORNGE? See that's not fair, that's not what you said. Your statement includes ORNGE.... where you get a LOT of experience.

Also, I never once said anything about MY going to air right after ALS school, so I don't know why you are directing any comments specifically at my situation. You don't like me or the way I am going about my education, I gotcha on that one. Duly noted.

[akroeze]

Why is it that in the US everyone says don't even bother working at the BLS level, go straight to ALS and here we say you have to work for years at the BLS level before going to ALS?

Everyone thinks it is a great idea for you to be an ALS provider without independent experience in the states, but cross the border and it's heresy? Why?

Without actual studies on the benefits of prior experience vs little to no experience, any statements such as this are pure speculation and anecdotes. The system should be set up to adequately determine if someone can do the job they need to do. If they can not, they do not make it into that role.

[NickMedic]

Why do people in the US go from BLS to ALS with no experience? I don't know! maybe because BLS is a 200 hour course and ALS is another 700 hours! Its a profit driven business in the US for the most part. You will find most of the publicly funded fire response services have ALS medics with tons of experience and the private low paying companies (profit driven) are the ones who hire ALS with no experience! Why does Canada have social healthcare and the US not? The fact is the systems are different!

I stated that working for ORNGE on one of THEIR aircraft is different than working for the SOA! Two totally different beast. Working for ORNGE, you do on scenes dealing with real serious pts everyday! SOA, transfers! When I refer to air, I usually mean the ORNGE aircraft and employees!

You told me the burden of proof is on me, I was just proving my point. I am sorry I don't agree with going to ALS with no real experience! Im sorry if you feel that it is a personal attack! As I said previously, good luck (honestly) with the course, and I hope things work out for you I am really not trying to be a prick, just trying to tell you that you have an uphill battle. This is a topic that really urks me, which is why I am passionate about it!

[akroeze]

Why do people in the US go from BLS to ALS with no experience? I don't know! maybe because BLS is a 200 hour course and ALS is another 700 hours! Its a profit driven business in the US for the most part. You will find most of the publicly funded fire response services have ALS medics with tons of experience and the private low paying companies (profit driven) are the ones who hire ALS with no experience! Why does Canada have social healthcare and the US not? The fact is the systems are different!

I stated that working for ORNGE on one of THEIR aircraft is different than working for the SOA! Two totally different beast. Working for ORNGE, you do on scenes dealing with real serious pts everyday! SOA, transfers! When I refer to air, I usually mean the ORNGE aircraft and employees!

You told me the burden of proof is on me, I was just proving my point. I am sorry I don't agree with going to ALS with no real experience! Im sorry if you feel that it is a personal attack! As I said previously, good luck (honestly) with the course, and I hope things work out for you I am really not trying to be a prick, just trying to tell you that you have an uphill battle. This is a topic that really urks me, which is why I am passionate about it!

I know that I have an uphill battle but I feel it is a battle worth fighting. My situation is such that had I not gone for it now, I would likely never have gone to the ALS level. So when it comes to do it or don't, I'm going to do it. I don't and won't regret it, but I'm not blind to the difficult time that may be ahead of me.

Just out of curiosity, what area do you practise ALS in?

I agree that working for ORNGE gets you lots of experience and SOA relatively little. I guess somehow we got into a disagreement even though we agree? Sorry if that was my fault in any way but in regards to air experience I agree with you. Which is why if I were to work air at any point in my career it would be with ORNGE.

I'll try not to take things personally in the future man. Sometimes hard when someone is telling you you are wrong for what you are doing though, but I'll try.