cynical_as_hell

I won't speak for the rest of the EMS world on this but for my area, I think I know what the problem. Now I am not a paramedic, however I just recently sat through a paramedic refresher class because my partner needed it. What I noticed is that there were guys in there teaching that have been in the field for 15-20+ years. They were still going over the way they learned things, and barely touched on any of the updates. Drugs weren't discussed at all. The instructors would get frustrated when one of the newer (1-5 years) paramedics would question them on something, or explain to them why what they were saying was wrong. The updates that were discussed were the ones our medical director changed and of course the current standard for CPR.

EMS cant advance if no one is teaching the new stuff. EMS cant advance if those ancient medics arent willing to change the way they do things. Now I may be completely off base here, but this is just one of the things I saw wrong with my area's current system. The other thing would be that because field workers are teaching other current field workers, everyone just blows through everything because they all figure, "Well you've seen me work in the field. You know I know how to do my job." That would be the second problem in my opinion.

Well at least that's

emt322632:

that is a very touching story. I'm sorry that you and your wife had to face that kind of decision, but it sounds like you made the right one and that it was all worth it. My case is similiar to yours. I had to choose rather to keep my son or not when I found out I was pregnant. And we were given all the possible outcomes as well. And I too made the same choice you and your wife did. He is now 3.5 years old and excelling in life. My son was born 1.5 months early. Some of the scariest events in our lives are the ones that make us the strongest. Good luck to you and your family.

Well at least that's one less illigal immagrant taking up all the government help that they truly don't have a right to.

I would like to see the patients have more credibility. Just because a paramedic documents that a patient was ALOC doesn't mean that the patient isn't aware of what went on. I see alot of paramedics automaticly acuse teenagers of drug use and treat them like crap, down talk them, and flat out call them liars when the teenager is having a medical problem and states that they haven't used any drugs. If the patient or parent calls and makes a complaint, they aren't taken seriously because the medic's first care form states that the patient was ALOC. EMS documentation isnt the end all be all of proving what happened on that scene.

I have not seen a policy with my company about the acceptance of gifts. I know that we have always been told not to though. In most cases in my area, the patient brings to the station a plant, cake, donuts, cookies, ect... We politely say thank you, listen to whatever they have to say and then if it's food, throw it away once they are gone. I know that sounds mean, but you never know what they put in the food they have brought you, if anything. We look at it as it's better safe than sorry. I don't know of anyone that has had a past patient try to give them gift cards or cash.

I agree with the fact that alot of people in ems are overweight. I think that employers should set standards, just like they have with lifting capabilities. I wonder if between the insurance company the employer has and the employer themself, if the employees could get a discounted price to a gym? It would help out on reducing the number of work related injuries, for example, the back, and would save the employer money because their employees,if working out, would be spending less time out on work injuries. Who knows, every company is different.

sorry i must have not been paying attention to the time of incident.

Here are some questions that come to mind:

How busy was the er?

How long had he been waiting?

What was so important that he felt that his actions were appropiate?

Not that the answers to any of these questions will ever make his actions right, but it would be nice to know.

My company has an actual policy that says that if you get a DUI while on your own personal time, then you are fired. They have a zero tolerance for it. In the state I live in you have to report it to DHS and I believe, although not certain, that the state pulls your cert. Again, I'm not certain on the last one. But I know for certain that my company fires that employee.

Maybe I'm not understanding this correctly, but if the nurses had already confirmed that he had a pulse and was breathing...then why did they feel that they needed to look into his mouth....with a nail file to say the least....

If the attempts were recent, then I would have some serious concern over hiring such a person. But at the same time, I'd want to know what was the event or circumstance for this person to be pushed to that point. I believe that at some point in everyone's life they feel overwhelmed and have thoughts of suicide, I think that's a normal part society....but it all goes back to what's going on with that person at that time and how likely are they to follow through with their thoughts?? I think that you would have a hard time not hiring for this reason without a discrimination lawsuit on your hands, unless you have it in your policy that all potential employees go through a psych eval. If you do have that in your policy, then it comes down to if this particular person passed or not. If they don't pass, then you have no worries, but if they do pass, then maybe this is just a thing of the past...sorry if im not much help..

I may not have been watching close enough but to me it looks like she was kicking the door, the officers came in, started assaulting her, and so forth. The issue that I have is there is no reason for them to bring her to her feet by pulling her hair. That alone should get them canned!!!

While I agree that we are not law enforcement, I would most definetly turn in an illigal. Yes, they would still get the treatment required, but that doesnt change the fact that they dont have a right to be here, for lack of a better way to put it. How many of these illigals are getting gov help because they were able to make fake documents....??? Why should our country and the future of our country suffer because of people like these. I firmly believe that if anyone wants to come here, then they need to do it the right way.

As EMS providers we are required by law to report any suspicions of child abuse, adult abuse, or any violent acts of crime. We get in trouble if we dont. Now doesnt that seem like it's law enforcements responsibility, not ours? I don't feel that there is any difference between these scenarios and the question at hand about reporting illigals. But, everyone has their opinions and that's fine too.

I appreciate everyones comments and ideas. They have been very helpful. The reason why I had so much concern with this call and rather to c spine or not is due to a call awhile back. It was a rollover on the highway. The female pt that we had was not complaining of any neck or back pain. Her concern was the tooth that she broke during the roll. We went ahead and cspined her anyway, only to find out later that she had a fractured neck, but just couldnt feel it.

Once again, thank you to everyone for your comments

Even though we know that you put on this display, to look like an idiot here. If you truly thought that way. I would not only fire you, but push to have your cert revoked.

For you to come on a public forum and spot off like an ass, does nothing for EMS. If you truly feel that way, McDonald's is always hiring!

Perhaps you are just spouting off on things you know nothing about. Certs aren't issued based on personality. To get that revokesd, you would have to actually do something wrong. Perhaps its the people in EMS that kiss the ass of every patient and allow them to abuse the 911 system that gets everyone else burnt out. If EMS still stood for what it was meant to be in the beginning and we didnt put up with the frequent flyer shit, EMS would have a better name for itself. As far as working at McDonalds, Sorry, that doesnt fit my schedule. I enjoy only working 10 days a month.

Ask yourself, how many people that get into EMS actually stay in it once they are burnt out for any other reason than the schedule it has???

+1

That did nothing but make you look like a Grade A Jackass, cynical. And not the kind people respect either. Try spending some time, or living for a few years, or being the son of an "old and senile" man. Then come back and tell us what you learned. The more I read your comment the more amazed I get that a so called "professional" EMS worker would say something like that, ESPECIALLY in a public forum. Probably a good thing you don't put what town you work in, I am sure your populus would LOVE to read statements like that coming from one of their Ambulance Drivers.

my company is well aware of how i feel about things. I am not one to sit back and let my thoughts be unknown. The difference between me and most, I can put on a pretty dam good game face when dealing with the public. It's easy to full idiots into thinking you truly care what's going on in their life. This job is like any other job, its not more special, or more fulfilling. Its a job.

I understand your concerns with getting a national registry title. My input for you is to go for it. I'm suprised to hear that there are states that do not recognize that, but here's the deal: What if something happened and you had to move to another state, for whatever the reason may be, if you hold a national registry card, you will be able to work in that state at your cert level, until you can get the new state's emt state card. National registry allows you to work anywhere in the united states. If you decide that you need a change of scenery, well then with national registry it will be easier for you to get hired on somewhere else and it buys you time to obtain the new state card. I strongly recommend that you go ahead and go for it.

ABSOLUTELY!!!! AGAIN, THE COMMON COMMUNITY NEEDS TO REALIZE AND ACCEPT THE FACT THAT AS MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS, IN ALL ASPECTS, WE STILL HAVE A JOB TO DO!!!!!

BS to all who say no to family participation in medicine. If the patient allows for a family member to be there, then I have no problem bringing the family member with us to the hospital. We, as medical professionals, are supposed to not only treat the physical alterations of our patients, but make sure we can keep our patients emotionally satisfied too. In cases where patients are on the verge of death, it is proper to allow family to enter to being a grieving process.

I seem to remember a thread dealing with tattoos where a large number thought tattoos were making patients uncomfortable and even distressed. So, why are we going to place a child in the back of the ambulance and make the child distressed because we wanted to show our 'authority' of the ambulance and place the parent up front? I can see regulating tattoos, but messing around with emotional and familial bonds should not happen.

How about the older senile family member who does not feel comfortable alone, and requires the presence of family members? How about cultures that prefer to have certain family members present for all medical care?

None of that is our problem!! They let their choices go out the window when they or their family activated 911. Now don't get me wrong, they can refuse any kind of treatment that EMS may want to do, but what you are talking about in your post is a hospital problem, not ems. If they are old and senile, then they aren't going to remember anything that goes on and if it is a cultural issue, then, sorry, but we have a job to do. And when it comes to children, parents tend to make the child more aggitated because they cant control themselves. Regardless how you want to look at it to justify somebody riding in that is not seeking medical attention, we still have a job to do and we need to cover our own butts. So what if their feelings get hurt or they get offended, at least you will still have a job. There's nothing that states that we have to allow anybody to ride in.

There is no reason a family member can not ride up front, seatbelted, unless you have something to hide.

nothing to hide, they just become a liabililty and are often times annoying and distracting. For example, I had a mom ride in with me recently, somebody who claims to be so concerned over her daughter, yet while enroute to the hospital, she found it ok to make multiple phone calls on her cellphone while her daughter was in the back of the rig. Doesn't seem to me that she was that concerned.

What about the emergency room? Does the medical staff have a right to exclude family members from the trauma suite?

ABSOLUTELY!!!! AGAIN, THE COMMON COMMUNITY NEEDS TO REALIZE AND ACCEPT THE FACT THAT AS MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS, IN ALL ASPECTS, WE STILL HAVE A JOB TO DO!!!!!

No you wouldn't and if you tried to force your way you would be arrested. We will not move the ambulance till you are removed. So you just harmed the person you claim to love by being unreasonable.

Even when we take a parent they ride in the cab not in the patient compartment. They have to be seatbelted.

WAY TO GO SPENAC!!!! Personally i believe that no one needs to be in the ambulance other than the employees and the patient. Anyone else that wishes to can meet the ambulance at the hospital. Despite the fact that we are transporting somebody's loved one, the common community needs to realize that we still have a job to do.

I have been thinking about this call since it happened and now it's really starting to bug me, so I would like input from the rest of you as to how you would have handled this call...

Called to the scene of a MVA, dispatch says that an off duty officer believes that a possible heart attack is the reason for the accident. We got on scene to find in vehicle 1 an elderly man who is extremely aggitated, complains of no injuries, and confirms that he remembers the accident. Vehicle 1 has airbag deployment. Vehicle 2 has two passangers who are out walking around and are refusing all treatments and transportation. SO back to vehicle 1.... The patient tells the fire department that he remembers the accident but shortly after tells the police that he does not. When questioned by EMS about remembering the accident, he says that he doesn not remember. After the fire department does their evaluation and checks the pts glucose level, they get a reading of 49. The patient decides to go to the hospital, I told my partner, who then passed on to fire, that the patient needed to be c spined due to mechanism and airbag deployment. The paramedic from the fire department then told us the they were not going to c spine the patient because the patient was not complaining of any neck or back pain. She then questioned the fire medic about not c spining even though there was airbag deployment. The fire medic replies with "Airbag deployment doesn't mean anything because they go off at 20 mph as well as higher speeds. It's not important."

So again, my question to you, Would you have done c spine on this patient or not and why? I feel that it should have been done but even in my own department I'm getting different opinions.

It's all irrelevant. A baby is a baby, whether the father was a rapist or not. Kill the rapist, not the baby. Perhaps YOU should stay out of this one until you grow some ethics.

Before you critisize my ethics, perhaps you need to pull your head out of your butt and see this for what it is. You're poor attitude on life is making your perceptions and you have no intelligence behind it. Quite worrying about trying to be a hot shot here and always be right and maybe you will understand rape victims and why it would be better for them to not carry on a pregnancy that is caused by such actions.

I fail to see how it is different. Either life has sanctity, or it does not. Who the father is is irrelevant. How about we just start euthanising all babies without fathers? Maybe euthanise all homeless people too? See the problem there? Rape or not, the baby is still human life. Deal with it.

would you want to go through all the things that pregnancy causes and give birth to a child that was only concieved due to an act of a violent crime??? you are better off staying out of this one unless you can understand fully what changes women endure and the aftermath of a pregnancy before you decide that even if a woman was raped that she should still have that child.

Good points there spenec.....the arguement of "its my body" well if you're going to spread your legs for some man then you need to be prepared for the consequences. i think that if somebody gets pregnant, chooses to abort that child, then they should be sterilized right after because apearantly they arent capable of making mature decisions. I do however feel that if a woman is raped, or there are medical reasons for an abortion, then that's a different story. We live in a society that seems to think that sex has no consequences and more and more women have the attitude of "Well i can just get an abortion." I side with spenec on this one