the_rogueEMT

all I have to say...and even then I can't take credit for it...so as Glenn Beck says "Game on progressives, we'll see you at the polls this November."

most of my training is self taught or I picked up from various places. Now with swords and knife and the like I train at least 4hrs a day. so which do you want

Let me ask two questions.

Question 1 - does anyone here think that the cost estimates will turn out to be right for this bill or are you like me, skeptical because the history of this government is to live beyond it's means. We take in less money in taxes than we put out or we would have a balanced budget or a budget surplus.

Question 2 - soon to follow but I lost my train of thought.

Answer 1 - We are already in debt so why not put us more into debt. So no I personally do not think it will work out

Answer 2 - that happens to the best of us.

CNN is a good news channel but frankly I don't care for that channel cause unlike Fox News (who ask the actual tough questions) all they ask (and this is just in general, i do not know if it was an actual question) "so how about them RedSox?" But I also agree that are former health care industry did need a change just not one that was jammed down our throats like this was. In my opinion Pelosi, Obama, DNC pretty much said sit down, shut up and just take it. Trust us we know whats good for you. If they do then how come they are not subject to the bills they sign into law...huh. In my opinion we should elect a whole new group or ppl in both the Senate and House. Keep those who have had only 1 term (if there is any) but everyone else just vote out. that way it will also show the DNC that WE THE PEOPLE want OUR ELECTED OFFICIALS to do what we want and not what they want. Yes the GOP all voted against the bill, Great they did what we wanted along with the hand full of Dems. Speaking of compromise, there willing to sit down with Iran but not a group of TEA Party members or 9/12ers. Whats wrong with that picture....just food for thought the last part was.

Hey, I'm not saying I condone the violence. I'm saying that I am angry enough, and I rarely ever get angry, that I can understand it.

I am there with you and there are those on this site who would think I would be right throwing actually throwing rocks cause of "actions" that I "did" in the chat room. But contrary to popular belief I am a non-violent person, although I do get angry like everyone else in the world but it takes a h3ll of a lot to set me off. Yes I am close but at the same time I am not if that makes since.

You know what? I am damn sick of all the exaggeration and violent talk! DAMN SICK OF IT! More profanity would be included if this were not an internet forum. But seriously people? I am ashamed that some of us are now cheering on death threats? Saying Obama has now ruined the whole country? Revolution is the only answer? I didn't see anyone b1tching like this when the federal gov't saw its largest expansion ever under Bush. Now some of you sound like chicken little with talk of how "the sky is falling!" I don't necessarily agree with Obama's bill or many elements of his presidency, but as an EMS professional, citizen, and human being, I know how to appropriately express my views and push for change. I am disgusted to hear some of the talk on here. You need to realize there are two sides to every issue, maybe try to look at the other side of things, or the positive in this very bill. More help for children with pre-existing conditions gets my full support! I DO think there needs to be HEALTHY debate about the economic implications and things I don't personally care for such as cuts in care for senior citizens, but come on people, lets grow up, clean up our act, and stop these INFANTILE EXPLANATIONS of complex issues. This does not apply to all posters or even posters who are against the bill. If it applies to you, you probably already know it.

Tom is right, just because you don't like the bill that was passed does not mean go and throw actual rocks and that persons office or even send mail with baby powder in it. What that does mean is that in November when some of those ppl who voted for the bill are up for re-election you vote them out of office. Like Glenn Beck said in one of his shows this week "Game On Progressives, we will see you at the polls this November." So don't stoop to the level of actually throwing stuff or sending death threats cause if you do then your only proving that the left is right. that the TEA Party goers and 9/12ers are nothing than a bunch of vigilanties out for revenge just cause there representative did not vote how they want. Ghandi once said (and forgive me if I misquote) "Use truth as your anvil, and peace as your hammer." That is what you do, you hold to your beliefs and do so in a peaceful way.

I hate to threadjack, but while I appreciate your enthusiasm and apparent patient advocacy mentality, I fail to see where you make this connection. Whether or not it is a good bill (of which I'm not sure), I have an impossible time believing that ANYONE is ever going to ask you to NOT care for someone who needs help. This comment sets you up as a self-righteous crusader without a crusade.

The economic points and finer details of patient care are all up for debate, and with good cause, but lets not hyperbolize the discussion with talk of death panels, and these "mystery patients" we will no longer be able to treat. Good debate aims to tease out the truth, while debate just to win becomes eristic.

this is why I opened this thread is for a debate/conversation....so threadjack away if you want, and with that said I am still a noob in some ways ya know and I will admit that...but I have also learned from my other mistakes from stuff that I have done in this site (those who know, know what I'm talking about) but with each "lesson" I learn something new...and I am open for ppl to correct me if they think i'm wrong

emtannie--> I have talked to other US members on this site, one of whom explained it to me very well. The independence from government, and self-sufficiency is every important to US citizens, and “I had that child, it is my responsibility to care for it.” I get that, and I respect and understand that position. I just don’t think it is possible to be prepared for the worst possible scenario, and the costs involved. I just wish that people didn’t have to forego medical treatment for their child because of financial reasons, when the parents are middle-class employed individuals – I couldn’t imagine how that would feel.

I agree with that persons statement that if they had the child they should take care of it. Also like many Americans I admit our healthcare does need to be changed but not to the point where the gov't controls 1/6 of the U.S. economy. Pres. Obama does have a good idea don't get me wrong I just think he went about fixing it the wrong way...

everyone has good ideas it is how we go about putting them into action that makes them good or bad ideas

when exactly did Obama tell you not to care for someone/some subset of patients?

your right he did not say that, but in my opinion that is what it will come to with the gov't paying the bill for the most part, and like I said before yes I am not cert'd so I don't know everything per se in the medical field but if I were cert'd as an EMT-B my first responsibility it to the pt. and no one else unless they are in danger and they are at the scene of any given call I may be on. But I am not cert'd so...but if I see something happen I will step up and care for that pt. till better help arrives.

...I also wonder about the ppl whose religion does not beilieve in medical treatment, what they think...

that is another good point tamaith, I my self didn't even think about that. But along those lines isn't there supposed to be separation of church and state and freedom of religion. With this bill being doesn't this bill now become like some state Attorney Generals are saying...that this bill in un-constitutional and there for should become null and void

this is what I wanted about this thread is one that ppl can talk about there views and not get jumped on...in my city Portsmouth, VA there is a restaurant near me with all this Obama stuff and I had an "Impeach Obama" and all I did was of course cover my face, but I held it up to the window (not banging on it or anything threatening) and just shook my head yes and just leave....the owner comes out and says "are you trying to tell me something" and I said "its just freedom of speach" next thing I know I have 3 squad cars...anyways I felt like if I did say I did that, that I would have been taken to jail for my freedom....but in my few yrs. I've been a member of this site ppl always jump on someone for there views or something and this thread I think that has not happened so props to everyone on this thread for not jumping on the other person who disagrees with you...keep this thread going cause its helping me also in my opinion of this bill...which Pres. Obama will be signing 2morrow

I would love to hear from the Dr.s in this forum as well cause there point of view would be nice to know....but like I stated when I first started this thread "first do no harm" I may not be cert'd yet but still I would treat the pt. no matter what the commander in chief said, yes he is the leader of this nation but he is ultimately not my boss and unless someone is holding a gun to my head saying do this and don't do this, that pt. will get the best treatment that I can provide at my level. Just for the record I am not cert'd as I said but I do have training as an EMT-B and as such I am still covered by the Good Samaritan Law

.....*gets out the popcorn and pulls out a chair for this one*.....

that figures...but I actually am not going to start anything...I stated my opinion and scubakate stated hers...that is why I started this thread...but by all means pull up a chair and watch the thread and maybe even comment if you want Don...unlike my gov't I don't force ppl to do anything

I first want to say to all the EMS workers and ER workers "first do no harm" I say that because that healthcare reform was passed, and we need to realize that were looking out for the patient and not big gov't. With that said what are your views on Obamacare.

not even I would post that 4c6....I could have lived without seeing that but still it was a little funny but not very

I am moving to the Appalachian Mountains this sunday and am wondering how different because I know there is a difference. We briefly went over mtn. fire/rescue in the book but did no scenarios. So my question is what should I expect with farmland/Mountain fire/rescue. I welcome any and all advice.

Wish granted Terri says "you know I wish I had " Octuplets"

I wish I could get lucky with my wife

Lets find out

Wish granted but you will die the next day(only thing I could come up with sorry)

I wish that life was not always so complicated

Dead and Gone by T.I.

Bring Me to Life by Evanescence

1) Wish Central grants the Latte Machine, but the caffeine now has you so wired, when you're off, you cannot sleep, even though you want to.

2) Wish Central Doesn't need to grant that wish, as you are already saving the world, one life at a time, and sometimes 2 at a time!

I wish I could come up with some better, not so lame, wishes to ask for..

Wish granted now all your wishes are extremly well thought out plees for attention.

I wish it was the Summer now but with spring temps.

intentions

of

Wish granted now there are no more mistakes but the down is is they cost the tax payers 100000 dollars.

I wish the Easter bunny would bring me what Santa didnt.

Wish granted but now there is no more christmas because for the easter bunny to do that it had to kill Santa.

I wish that people would see live from my own sick and twisted (according to certain people) perspective and realize I am a truly nice person

granted now your house is a self cleaning litterbox

I wish terri smelled better:D

Wish is granted the only draw back is that what ever smell terri had is now on you for ever and eternity

I wish the people would let other people know what mistakes they made so they don't make them again

Wish granted but you now look like cousin IT

I wish The admin would get the bite me smilie

Wish granted...now the bite me smilie is the only smilie we have to use

I wish that people would give other people a second chance and forget about past actions.

Wish granted, but your worst enemy can also teleport, and both of you teleported to the same exact location, at exactly the same time, and now the two of you are inextricably intermixed at the molecular level, in one super dense body, thoughts included.

I wish I knew a shortcut, in both time and space, to my place of work, that nobody else knew about, including a legal parking space to put my POV.

Wish granted.....but now you are stuck in a time where the gas prices are $10 per gallon

I wish that I was completly healthy and able to enlist in the U.S. Army (oorah{sp})

Wish granted, you have your jaw. But you have no teeth at all and have to live on pureed everything.

I wish cardiology/acls/ecg would fall into place for me!

Wish granted but now you have to work with Pres. Obama as your partner

I wish that people would forgive me for my mistakes that I have made in here