What role does/should EMS play in rescue?

[NREMT-Basic]

As a new member of a state medical emergency response team ( we primarily respond disaster mass casualties, man made and act of "God" type). I will be taking my teams course in technical rescues which will include extrication, disentanglement, cribbing, high angle, confined space, etc. Is there room for EMTs and Medics in the world of rescue or should they remain sort of separate entities with no cross over. I know what as an EMT, I have started the extrication process with a crash ax on more than on occasion before fire arrived. What say you all?

[cullen l]

i belive that all of us as first responders "whoever" needs to do their best in all situations to save life and limb at any cost.

[JPINFV]

i belive that all of us as first responders "whoever" needs to do their best in all situations to save life and limb at any cost.

Mind rephrasing that in a way that would get a passing score in first grade?

I believe that you are saying that "I believe that all of us needs to do our best in all situations to save life and limb at any cost."

So, ignoring your lack of any ability to form a coherent sentence [ya know, those pesky things like sentence construction, subject-pronoun agreement, punctuation, etc], lets look at your statement in terms of this thread.

Unfortunately, your statement is so wishy washy that it is near impossible to discuss. What exactly does "do their best" mean? Does that mean that people should start infringing on specialized fields for no simple reason besides 'just in case?' Should we start training psychiatrists to perform cardiac surgery 'just in case?' Should we be training people in other fields even if it starts to interfere with their primary job function? Sure, it might suck standing around because you can't do anything, but unless you have the training, education, and supplies to do something like extrication, then you ARE doing your best by not making the situation worse.

"save life and limb at any cost."

Nope, sorry, I have to disagree with this one too. I will not put myself at undue risk to save a life. My job is NOT to run into situations that are dangerous unless it is medical in nature. A fire, regardless of who may be trapped inside, is not a medical situation. Contagious disease, on the other hand is. Even when it is medical in nature, my presence will not be had until appropriate safety measures have been taken to minimize the risk that I have to take. No one needs another causality.

[brentoli]

[s:5cb9bbda6b]Scout Oath[/s:5cb9bbda6b]EMS Oath

[s:5cb9bbda6b]On my honor[/s:5cb9bbda6b] I will do my best

[s:5cb9bbda6b]To do my duty to God and my country[/s:5cb9bbda6b]

[s:5cb9bbda6b]and to obey the Scout Law; [/s:5cb9bbda6b]

To help other people at all times;

[s:5cb9bbda6b]To keep myself physically strong, [/s:5cb9bbda6b]

[s:5cb9bbda6b]mentally awake, and morally straight[/s:5cb9bbda6b]

[Eydawn]

Brentoli, you must have been a boy scout... what rank did you get to?

I think EMS personnel should learn all sorts of rescue techniques... helps you to appraise a scene better if you're trained in tricky rescues and it helps you to think outside of the box as far as I'm concerned. If nothing else, you can be used in a pinch if it turns out that the rescue team needs more hands than they thought they did.

Besides, it would probably help you safeguard your own well being on a scene like that... since you would have been trained in how to handle those scenes...

Wendy

CO EMT-B

[brentoli]

Eagle Scout

Honestly though. I am all for EMS workers being prepared. There is nothing wrong with being trained in rope rescue or other specialties. The thing is though, YOU HAVE TO GO HOME. We have to realize when the effort is futile. Risk alot to save alot, risk little to save little.

[NREMT-Basic]

Mind rephrasing that in a way that would get a passing score in first grade?

I believe that you are saying that "I believe that all of us needs to do our best in all situations to save life and limb at any cost."

So, ignoring your lack of any ability to form a coherent sentence [ya know, those pesky things like sentence construction, subject-pronoun agreement, punctuation, etc], lets look at your statement in terms of this thread.

Unfortunately, your statement is so wishy washy that it is near impossible to discuss. What exactly does "do their best" mean? Does that mean that people should start infringing on specialized fields for no simple reason besides 'just in case?' Should we start training psychiatrists to perform cardiac surgery 'just in case?' Should we be training people in other fields even if it starts to interfere with their primary job function? Sure, it might suck standing around because you can't do anything, but unless you have the training, education, and supplies to do something like extrication, then you ARE doing your best by not making the situation worse.

"save life and limb at any cost."

Nope, sorry, I have to disagree with this one too. I will not put myself at undue risk to save a life. My job is NOT to run into situations that are dangerous unless it is medical in nature. A fire, regardless of who may be trapped inside, is not a medical situation. Contagious disease, on the other hand is. Even when it is medical in nature, my presence will not be had until appropriate safety measures have been taken to minimize the risk that I have to take. No one needs another causality.

Perhaps before you set to bashing others for the use of the English language in their posts, you should re-check your own before posting. As a former teacher, I found no fewer than 5 mistakes in your response.

Thanks to others for actually staying on topic.

[THEBEAR]

While I am trained in the areas you mention, I have different obligations while working as a Medic. There is more to consider than just your training. When I am working as a medic I'm not wearing the protective equipment that I am as a Firefighter. I'm no good to my Pt's if I'm injured. I wouldn't hesitate to act as necessary in an immediate life threatening situation but if there is time and personal properly equipped to perform rescue then it's best left to them.

[Dustdevil]

Do one thing and do it well.

To train a team up to minimum competency, and then to maintain that competency, is a major investment of time and money. If you are in an area that actually needs these services regularly, chances are that public safety is already handling this function. If so, stay off of their turf. It just creates friction we don't need.

Most stand-alone EMS agencies won't undertake the liability that comes along with such an operation. I don't blame them. Especially when there are other agencies that are specifically tasked by law and tradition to do it.

All that time and money I originally mentioned is time and money taken away from continuing medical education. There is no excuse for that. Again, do one thing and do it well. Or go be a firemonkey.

[Timmy]

Over here in Aussie I think the paramedics do a bit of rescue training. I’ve seen them put on a harness and abseil down a hole or cliff. I think a few states even have rescue paramedics like SCAT in NSW. Defiantly the Aeromeds have it.