Input please on outsiders helping on scene

[emtcater]

I'm an EMT/Security Officer for an off strip casino in Vegas. In the 3+ years I've been there, my Lt. and my Sgt. have made it clear to the other officers on the shift that the scene of a medical call is mine, and they are to defer to my judgement. The other officers have never had a problem with it, and am glad I'm there.

My dilema is this: on numerous occassions, someone has identified themselves as a medic/nurse, and have expected to take control of the scene. Some have been upset when I've politely explained that while I appreciate their offer, I have to ask them to step aside. My rational for this is that I have no idea who I'm dealing with, whether they know what they're doing, or whether they really are who they claim to be. Ultimately, it's my neck on the line. I simply don't have time to ask them to produce a card, and even if they do, how do I know it's current?

Am I wrong for expecting someone claiming to be a medic/nurse relinquish the scene once I'm there, or refusing their assistance?

<Edited for grammer>

[Freaknuggetz_chick]

i agree. its your job, your responsibility, your neck. be polite, thats all that should be needed.

[WelshMedic]

That said, is it prudent to decline all offers of help? I agree that it is primarily your responsibility. However, is it really necessary to send someone away when they are helpful and , more importantly, appear to be competent?

I have had this happen to me in the past, I was at the central railway station in Amsterdam when I noticed 2 police officers doing BLS in the bookshop. I went over to see if I could help, but was turned away by a third officer. I did leave because, as a professional, I did not want to make a scene - those that do make a scene, by the way, rightly get turned away.

Not saying you're doing anything wrong, but it is food for thought.

WM

[AZCEP]

Use them as trained bystanders. They will not be able to perform any treatments beyond what you have available anyway. If they take too much control of things, wait for the transporting agency to arrive, and watch the fireworks.

[DirtJerZ]

I need some more information. What type of Business/venue do you work for? What State are you in? What type of calls do you get? Do you do patient care reports and RMA patients.

[Lone Star]

Use them as trained bystanders. They will not be able to perform any treatments beyond what you have available anyway. If they take too much control of things, wait for the transporting agency to arrive, and watch the fireworks.

I would have to agree here, utilize them as if they were untrained bystanders. Stay within your scope of practice and have the patient transported (if necessary) as soon as possible. I had a RN stop and offer to assist on an MVA, but kept the call as BLS. When asked by my Director of Operations why...I explained that neither my partner or myself had the time to check her 'credentials' while dealing with patient care and packaging.

I need some more information. What type of Business/venue do you work for? What State are you in? What type of calls do you get? Do you do patient care reports and RMA patients.

It seems quite apparent that the original poster included that he works security at a casino in Las Vegas. I'm sure that his range of calls would include psychogenic shock, simple trauma (trip and fall, twisted ankles, etc) and possibly cardiac. (maybe even exhaustion from either heat or sleep deprivation?)

[emtcater]

As stated, I work for an off strip casino in Vegas. Our medical calls run the gamut... from minor slip and falls, to burns, and the occassional cardiac arrest. If I do more than put on a band aid, I generate an in house report.

[letmesleep]

ok, use them as stated above just don't loose your scene too them. Drives me up the wall when people show up like this. They are off duty, go away and enjoy your time at the casino, don't they get enough "action" at work? It might be different if they got there first and then turn everything over to you (including a pt report), but otherwise they are nothing more than a glorified "rubber-necker".

one word for these people.........whacker!

[Just Plain Ruff]

ok, use them as stated above just don't loose your scene too them. Drives me up the wall when people show up like this. They are off duty, go away and enjoy your time at the casino, don't they get enough "action" at work? It might be different if they got there first and then turn everything over to you (including a pt report), but otherwise they are nothing more than a glorified "rubber-necker".

one word for these people.........whacker!

I disagree on the whacker comment. What he described is not a whacker but someone who wants to help. You can always send them away.

For those of you who have stopped to help kudos but.... don't try to take over the scene.

but for every good experience that people have when stopping to help there will be an equal negative experience that someone else has happened.

For example, I was up in a small town north of Baltimore Md. I saw a woman who ran down a hill, fell into the roadway and then her arm was run over by a car that couldn't stop. That car kept going.

I held c-spine till EMS and Fire got there and I gave a report to the medic on scene. She then said, "you can leave now" no thanks, no appreciation. I told her I'm not leaving till someone takes over c-spine and she said "If you don't leave I'll have the officer remove you" I said "Ok, but I'm not leaving until someone from your crew takes over c-spine." a firefighter came over took over c-spine and I left, only to be stopped by the officer there wanting to know why I hit the lady.

Well, I was none to happy and I said, I did not hit her. He said witnesses said a car hit the lady. I said, I stopped 10 feet short of the patient and blocked the road so no-one else would hit her. I gave a description of the car and he took my information and I went on my merry way. After getting over the rudeness of the medic, I found the address of the EMS agency which was actually a fire based service. I drove directly to the station and discussed this medic's behaviour with her captain who promised he'd take care of it.

As a matter of fact, I got a apology letter from the Chief I talked to assuring me that her behaviour had been dealt with.

I don't care what service you work for, you don't treat people like that.

[mshow00]

Sorry for taking this off topic, but I fail to understand how being willing to help someone "off the clock" makes you a whacker? Maybe because I am still green and an idealist but I see no harm in at least offering help. I personally see that attitude as that of a burn out who needs to find a new line of work.