trailrunner78

Yeah, just for contract work. Contract specifies EMT-I, so........

Thanks for the help and your service, good luck with your recovery.

Need some input re: EMT-B/I training in the Las Vegas area. Are there any accelerated courses locally? If not, who offers the courses over the shortest period of time? I've considered going out to Indiana to emtinc.com for the "B" course, then doing the "I" course here in Vegas.

I do have some previous medical training, Level 2 First Aid Attendant up in Canada a few years back and current US Army CLS cert., as well as other stuff here and there so I am not completely new to the subject.

My time is my own, so I can do extra clinical/ride along for the experience. Trauma stuff would be good as the only place I will ever use this for a job is oversea's. Any suggestions?

Thanks in Advance.

Perhaps I missed this point in trying to follow the string. Has anyone mentioned allowing the self professed (state of the occurrance, not of the state, no regulatory needed in the state) "Bail Enforcer/Bounty Hunter" to accompany their "prisoner" as long as the local LEO also accompanies you in your ambulance?

I am aware, sometime over a year ago, we had a discussion on firearms in the ambulance (not carried by the crew or patient), and anyone wishing to return to that discussion should research the thread, and reopen it, if they feel they have something further to contribute ON THAT THREAD. (Trying to keep on track)

Oh no, you're not getting me into this one again......

Thanks for your patience.

How should we as EMS providers respond to your presence on A scene after you have re-arrested

a bail skip?

Previously addressed. Read more, post less.

but of corse when you have the time.

Still no SpellCheck, huh? "The learning curve is steep with this one"...... (Yoda voice)

As far as the racial comment is concerned, I have no idea where you think that you know me, or what I'm about, so I will ask of you, not to let that crap get started!

That would be "how", not "where".......There was no racial comment here, merely observation of reality in the ghetto. Are you one of those visible minorities who finds prejudice wherever they look and cries "racism" at every opportunity? I have zero respect for people like that. You just showed me "what you're about", you'll play the race card at the slightest opportunity, even manufacture one if you can. Thats "how" I know you, and "what" you're about, and I'm shocked, shocked I tell you..... :roll:

I think we're done here.....I am anyway......mods, please feel free to delete this whole back and forth between myself and "letmesleep" as not relevant to the thread topic, didn't mean to get off track, sorry.

http://www.ask.com/bar?q=Bail+Enforcement&...2FBounty_hunter

In the United States legal system, the 1872 U.S. Supreme Court case Taylor v. Taintor, 16 Wall (83 U.S. 366, 21 L.Ed. 287), is cited as having established that the person into whose custody an accused is remanded as part of the accused's bail has sweeping rights to recover that person (although this may have been accurate at the time the decision was reached, the portion cited was obiter dicta and has no binding precedential value). Most bounty hunters are employed by a bail bondsman: the bounty hunter is paid a portion of the bail the fugitive initially paid. If the fugitive eludes bail, the bondsman, not the bounty hunter, is responsible for the remainder of the fugitive's bail.

Thus, the bounty hunter is the bail bondsman's way of ensuring his clients arrive at trial. In the United States, bounty hunters catch an estimated 31,500 bail jumpers per year, about 90% of people who jump bail.[1] Bounty hunters are also sometimes known as "bail enforcement agents" or "fugitive recovery agents," which are the preferred industry and polite terms, but in common speech (and language), they are still called "bounty hunters".

Bounty hunters are sometimes called "skiptracers," but this usage can be misleading. While bounty hunters are often skiptracers as well, skiptracing generally refers to the process of searching for an individual through less direct methods than active pursuit and apprehension, such as private investigators or debt collectors. Skiptracing can also refer to searches related to a civil matter and does not always imply criminal conduct on the part of the individual being traced.

In the United States of America, bounty hunters have varying levels of authority in their duties with regard to their targets, depending on the states in which they operate. As opined in Taylor v. Taintor, and barring restrictions applicable state by state, a bounty hunter can enter the fugitive's private property without a warrant in order to execute a re-arrest. In some states, bounty hunters do not undergo any formal training, and are generally unlicensed, only requiring sanction from a bail bondsman to operate. In other states, however, they are held to varying standards of training and licensure. In California, bounty hunters must undergo a background check and complete various courses that satisfy the penal code 1299 requirements.[2] In most states they are prohibited from carrying firearms without proper permits. Louisiana requires bounty hunters to wear clothing identifying them as such.[3] In Kentucky, bounty hunting is generally not allowed because the state does not have a system of bail bondsmen, and releases bailed suspects through the state's Pretrial Services division of the courts, thus there is no bondsman with the right to apprehend the fugitive. Generally, only fugitives who have fled bail on federal charges from another state where bounty hunting is legal are allowed to be hunted in Kentucky.[3] In Texas, every bounty hunter is required to be a peace officer, Level III (armed) security officer, or a private investigator.[4]

State legal requirements are often imposed on out-of-state bounty hunters, meaning a suspect could temporarily escape re-arrest by entering a state in which the bail agent has limited or no jurisdiction.

And now you know more than you did when you posted that first piece of drivel.........a step in the right direction anyway......make sure you read all of it, and don't just pick the parts you think support your ignorance.........

Pardon me, but I, you, and any joe shmo can get a little badge from "Galls" saying "bail bounds enforcement" on it, and whammo, your a bondsmen with the same power as "DOG". There is no training necessary, you only have to go apply and get hired at any local bail bounds office. The only time there would be "training" is when you wish to carry a firearm. Maybe a little goggling should be done! As stated above, these people are simply citizens!

See, this is why I said you don't know what you are talking about. You apparently have zero idea where the legal authority to re-arrest someone who has bonded out of custody comes from. I don't the time or the inclination to educate you; you should be willing to do that yourself. Here's a hint; it's a very old Supreme Court decision that has to this day not been overturned and is still in force. You apparently don't even know what a bail bond is since you managed to misspell it twice, and an employee of a bail bondsman is not one himself, that is why they are called an agent. I won't even get into the fantasy that a bail bondsman will just hire any warm body who walks through his door, suffice to say that you need to bring something to the table other than near total ignorance of the job.

The State where I worked as an armed Private Detective Agency employee (Illinois) has no bail bond system, but we did get the occasional request from an out of state agency to check out the address of known relatives of a skip to see if he was hanging out there......we rolled with an AR15 and a 12ga. autoloader in the trunk in addition to our sidearms. If it's on your "Tan Card", you can have it.....The South and West Sides of Chicago are no place for an under-equipped or faint hearted white boy.

The reason it sounds like I know what I'm talking about is because I do. Unlike yourself, (PLEASE don't reply back and claim you have....) I've actually gone looking for bail skips. You having READ about this doesn't mean you KNOW anything about it, anymore than my having read about what an EMT-P does and putting that together with my piddly old Combat Lifesaver Qualification makes me a Paramedic.

Oh, and it's "Google", not "goggle". Goggles are what you wear on your face. After you square yourself away on that, investigate that little SpellCheck icon in the bottom right hand corner of the message body.....

No offense taken here, but in all reality they have the same arrest powers that you and I do.

You do not know what you are talking about here. Citizens are not allowed to force entry into a persons home to arrest without a warrant, even the Police need probable cause, exigent circumstance, or hot pursuit to do that, whereas Bail Agents are allowed to do exactly that. We are definitely not talking about citizen's arrest here; You may wish to google the subject. Are you thinking about security guards perhaps? In that case you would be correct, they have only the same powers of arrest as any other citizen, although there are also exceptions to that such as "Special Police" commissions from a municipality or Federal Property/GSA contracts where the security guard, while state licensed and employed by a guard company/contractor, actually has police powers while on Federal Property or while on duty. BTDT.

Reply within text, caps to indicate reply, not yelling.

no I'm not focused on my territory.

I'm still calling the police to figure this out. If after the police determine that this is legit then I'll let the bail agent ride with me but not until the local law enforcement agency deems it legit. NO RESPONSIBLE BAIL AGENT IS GONNA HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THIS.

It's one thing for a police officer to ride in the back with me but it's another thing to let someone who may not be familiar to me to ride with me, arrest powers or not. UNDERSTOOD.

Plus if I need to treat the patient neither the bail agent nor the police will dictate my treatment or choice of hospital if I determine the patient needs to go to a different one than they suggest. OF COURSE NOT.

Depending on the injuries.

I think the biggest issue here is familiarity. We don't get nearly as many arrests by bail agents than we do with law enforcement. That's the issue I think. I am sure that the services I used to work for had some sort of policy that we were supposed to follow regarding bail agents but since I've never been put in the position of a bail agent being there except for one time, it has never been tested. As a matter of fact I can count on the fingers of my left hand the number of colleagues that I know that have been exposed to bail agents and an injured detainee.

I WOULDN'T THINK IT LIKELY TO COME UP OFTEN.

Repetition begets familiarity and the services I've worked for never had many calls for injured detainees being arrested by bail agents.

but to just tell me "Im and bail agent and this is my prisoner" is gonna get me to reply "I'm going to have PD respond to make sure this is what it is" It's not the fact that I don't like bail agents nor is it the fact that I don't believe them but if I'm called to take care of a injured bail jumper and that injury was the direct cause of the person trying to get away and the bail agent took him down then I'm going to get law enforcement involved, I don't care it it's Duane Chapman or Dustdevil. I'm simply covering my butt.

Let me put this another way. Are the rules in your office the same for a bail agent as for the police? In both cases you are dealing with someone who has lawful arrest authority, who has just arrested someone who is authorized to be arrested. It sounds like you want to differentiate between the two for some reason that I'm pretty sure you can't justify and I'm suggesting that it's not really your job to decide that you will treat one differently than the other. You seem to be focused on "your territory" etc..

I hope you won't take offense (and you probably shouldn't unless you resemble my remarks) and if I've misunderstood your outlook on this it's all good. 8)

If you try to separate a "skip" from the agent who has him in custody, expect drama. Expect the skip to try and take advantage of your interference (as opposed to just practicing medicine) to escape if they are one of the "highly motivated" types, who will fake symptoms until a millisecond before doing their Jesse Owens impression. If you successfully interfere in a lawful arrest, the "skip" escapes, and ANYONE is subsequently injured or hurt in any way, expect you and your employer to be sued. As an EMT you have zero training and experience with arresting violent people, don't make the mistake of acting like you do. Many bail bond agents are former military or law enforcement themselves. Don't take Chapman and his freak show as anything like who you may be dealing with. He is an ex-felon himself, the former sergeant at arms of an outlaw motorcycle club who found Jesus once he was locked up as many of them do. His ex-felon status is why you do not see him carrying anything stronger than "Dog" repellent, Hawaii's laws on concealed carry notwithstanding.

Most of the time the PD will be on scene very quickly. Let them make any judgment calls.

I would be more than happy to give you more information on the system, the "Nation of Clark County" Health District and on the services here in town. Send me a private message and I will give you more contact info! Ashley aka "LasVegasEMTI"