SSG G-man Posted March 20, 2006 Share Posted March 20, 2006 I read about 75% of this thread before I was forced to reply. I love how everyone assumes volunteers only run a call a year and loose their skills. I am a volunteer, and volunteer only, but it is not standard at my station. I would say close to half of our active members are paid ff/EMT/Medic somewhere else. One of our members is an officer in Arlington County Va, a top rated department. He enjoys being a volunteer on his time off. My department will not allow you to respond to a scene from home unless you are a chief level officer. No lights and sirens on POV's. Most people give several hours at a time to be at the station. I am an NREMT-B and proud of it. I am proud to be a volunteer, and resent the fact that someone said volunteers do it to feel go about it not help other. So I guess the paid folks only do it for a paycheck, not to help anyone. I do do it to help. Just like I volunteered to join the National Guard in 1992. I joined the Guard instead of the reserves since the Guard handles state emergencies. I bet those that want to do away with Volunteers, want to get rid of the Guard and reserves. Be a real Soldier or don't join? Where would our country have been for the last 200 years with out the Citizen Soldiers? I digress, so I will stop ranting!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nsmedic393 Posted March 20, 2006 Share Posted March 20, 2006 I am a volunteer, and volunteer only, but it is not standard at my station. I would say close to half of our active members are paid ff/EMT/Medic somewhere else. Out of curiosity, how many calls do you run on in an average month? Is it required that half of your active members happen to work a paid gig or is it just happenstance? What about departments that don't have the benifit of having members that have some solid experience? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akflightmedic Posted March 20, 2006 Share Posted March 20, 2006 Correct me if I am wrong, but the guard and reservists collect a paycheck when on duty and when activated... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridryder 911 Posted March 20, 2006 Share Posted March 20, 2006 and yes the debate of professional soldier and reservists still goes on.......... With all the thought on how the well volunteer and the caring of so much.. if you really cared so much, would one want the BEST for the community and its residents ? ... This would be responders available for call immediately, (without any waiting for response) professional knowledge and requirements to be available for the citizens of the community. I wonder how many goes to a physician that only volunteers his/her services.. or would trust that individual. R/R 911 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MedicNorth Posted March 20, 2006 Share Posted March 20, 2006 This really irritates me when volunteers get slammed for "not caring about the community". Lets see - a small community with a volunteer squad versus a small community with nothing because there is not enough demand for a professional group. According to a lot of the posts above, the BEST thing to do would be to quit, because your call volume is too low to maintain skills. Makes eminent sense to me! Lets increase response times to 30 minutes or more waiting for pros to come from the next town. I wish the reality of things would allow for paid professionals in ALL emergency services, but it just isn't going to happen. Those who volunteer are doing so because at this moment it IS the best thing for their community. By the way, there are physicians who do a lot of volunteer work in inner cities and in third world countries. Should I mistrust them because of that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSG G-man Posted March 20, 2006 Share Posted March 20, 2006 Okay, I think my comment about the Guard and reserves was taken out of context, or misunderstood. The point was that if volunteer EMS providers want to be an EMS provider they should choose it as a full time job, then the "part-time Soldiers" should all quit and become full time Soldiers because they can not possibly be effective in war since they only train one weekend a month. It was not a paid/ free context. As for the members that are professional, we are just lucky. We are a suburb of Washington, DC. We have members that are paid in Fairfax County, VA, Arlington County, VA, Washington, DC, Prince George's county, VA and one of the Local airports. We also have folks that work for transfer service and MEDStar. I just do not think that all Volunteers can be lumped together as nit having experience, etc. Also, I know paid EMT/Medics that work 24 on / 72 off. If they have a slow day at work, are they getting more experience that runs a couple of calls each night of the week or spends all weekend running calls. Also, EMT-Medics in a lot of paid fire based services have to do both, so they may go extended periods of time with out running a EMS call. I just do not like being put down because I chose to be a Soldier who found he has a side of him that is interested in EMS. I would have to take a hell of a pay cut to go into EMS as a career now, but do plan on doing it when I retire. Sarge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akflightmedic Posted March 20, 2006 Share Posted March 20, 2006 Well the subject got a little off topic. It is a free/paid argument. I have not questioned the level of care provided by vollies. What this thread originally was about is what is best for the community and how vollies continue to take jobs from paid guys due to their kind heartedness. Vollies can be used to augment a system as Dust said, but they should never be the sole providers. Step back and look at the big picture, dont allow your feelings or ego to be insulted. Statistically speaking, which is better for a community? Which would you rather have in your own backyard? A system in place that is ready to roll at a moments notice or volunteers responding from who knows where and how long. Volunteers can not be held accountable for slow response times or failure to maintain training standards unless the administration self imposses that which is rare. After all, they are volunteers donating their time and services..if you dont like it, they will quit..and we can't have that cause that would mean we would have to start our own system. Who does the checks and balances on the system? We have talked many times on this site about how to get the pay we deserve and elevate our positions to one that deserves the respect of our peers. If we continue to give things away for free, the town, city, whatever will continue to abuse it and stuff the money elsewhere instead of the EMS system where it should be. The money is out there. There are federal and state grants for this sort of thing. However, this argument is a moot one due to the nature of EMS. Volunteerism is on a decline and with the increase in education standards, it will all fall to the wayside in a matter of years. Then maybe we will get the pay and respect we deserve. If they would hurry up and enforce the college degree reuirement in EMS, we could elimate 99 percent of the volunteers and start demanding higher wages. If I sound bitter, it is because I do like to help people, but I also need to get paid. IN 12 years of doing EMS, I have NEVER worked only one job or turned down overtime opportunities. It wasn't just me either, cause I tend to live beneath my means. As I looked around at all my co-workers, they too were working multiple jobs and/or returning to school so they could afford to live. If there is anyone on this site that is a full time paid EMS person and only works one job, please make yourself known. It is a rarity I assure you. Even EMTCIty Admin has a second job..this website. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EMT City Administrator Posted March 20, 2006 Share Posted March 20, 2006 Even EMTCIty Admin has a second job..this website. Actually it is my third, first i work a truck full time, then I teach, then I am the mayor of the great city. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridryder 911 Posted March 20, 2006 Share Posted March 20, 2006 I chuckle when I see comparisons of physicians, nurses, etc doing volunteer work and comparing it to EMS functions. First, I do volunteer my time as a nurse to free clinics, and medical missionary groups when possible, like so many others. When you look at the "make-up of the medical group however, you do not see volunteers that is their only exposure of medicine. These folks are either retired from professional medicine (where they did it paid full time) or they work in medicine full time. I have yet met (29 years) anyone that went to medical school/nursing school to donate their services all the time and never be compensated. I can assure you that the medical profession (hence.. profession) has never considered that its members not be reimbursed for its services. It would be nice that member of EMS could afford to be able to volunteer areas of the world that is lacking in health-care. Most I have found are not financially able to donate time due to working 2 to 3 jobs, to make ends meet as described. Again, I have not seen any professional describe to eliminate the volunteer, rather change the role of the volunteer to a first responder role. This has been performed in my area and has been very successful. Decreased time the volunteers have to spend on a call, education provided by professional EMS so certifications and CEU's can be obtained easier and less costly, and less financial burden on the system. This has actually helped the volunteer agencies and increased their memberships. We have developed a good working relationship with these agencies and have actually hired some to our professional service. As described volunteerism is diminishing, maybe a change in role and functions, they will be able to continue their services. R/R 911 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippyRN Posted March 20, 2006 Share Posted March 20, 2006 <snip> I wish the reality of things would allow for paid professionals in ALL emergency services, but it just isn't going to happen. Those who volunteer are doing so because at this moment it IS the best thing for their community. the problem arises when standards of care aren't reasonable becasue each little settlement wants it' own service , rather than a regional services providing ALS and BLS Ambulances crewed by paid staff (including casuals if necessary) and utilising volunteer first responders to fill the therapeutic vaccum what's better FR in 4 minutes and ALS in 12 or BLS in 10 or more after the second set of tones goes out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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