Alberta EMT-P Industrial Day rate

[northernboy]

Hi gang,

I have been qualified as an EMT-P for a few yrs, prior to that I spent 3-yrs in the Military as a med tech but didn't do any special other than outpatient work/Fd amb (as in no combat tours).

I am looking at going to University fulltime so I wanted to drop myself down to part time with the city and supplement that with industrial work. The question is when I look at the job offers many of them say to put forward my salary expectations. I have heard from people that the going rate is $600-800/day but this is usually from people when I push them on it they have never actually done any industrial work. I have taken a bunch of industrial day course stuff like H2S alive etc to hopefully make me more hireable

So I have a few questions for anyone who has actually worked up north not if your neighbours friends brothers have

1. What is the typical rate I should be asking? hourly of daily?

2. Is there really a labour shortage, I see lots of job adverts but are these companies pulliing resumes so they can bid on projects or are there that many jobs available

3. Who paysfor travel as most of them seem to be GP or Ft Mac? Do you fly or drive?

4. how long are the typical rotations? 2-3wks

5. I would suspect the work is similar to being in a military field amb, lots of hurry up and wait, but no canvasor MRE's and little chance of an IED

6. is the pay normally a flat day rate or is it hourly then OT for more?

7. which are good comapanies to work for

thank you

[Tactical Spork]

Are you going to U of A, or U of C?

Your plan will work. Back in the day, I did that very plan. To answer your questions, I would have to say it depends. Sometimes a company covers specific costs, while other times they don't. It depends on the contract, as each one can be specific. I think your best bet would be to work with a few companies so you develop an understanding. They know what you are looking for, and you know what to expect from them. Just be up front with things as it is business. I can think of a few specific times where I let that point laps just to get burned in the end.

The other issue you may have is fitting things into your schedule. Depending on your course load time might be of a premium. Perhaps you might only be able to fit work into your reading week, for example. Of course, you can always take your textbook on the job as you will have plenty of study time .

Yes, the majority of you time at work will be just waiting for something to happen. Bring your textbooks.

A few people who frequent this site work in the industrial setting so, I am sure, you will get lots of useful input.

Feel free to PM me if you have any additional questions.

Hi gang,

I have been qualified as an EMT-P for a few yrs, prior to that I spent 3-yrs in the Military as a med tech but didn't do any special other than outpatient work/Fd amb (as in no combat tours).

I am looking at going to University fulltime so I wanted to drop myself down to part time with the city and supplement that with industrial work. The question is when I look at the job offers many of them say to put forward my salary expectations. I have heard from people that the going rate is $600-800/day but this is usually from people when I push them on it they have never actually done any industrial work. I have taken a bunch of industrial day course stuff like H2S alive etc to hopefully make me more hireable

So I have a few questions for anyone who has actually worked up north not if your neighbours friends brothers have

1. What is the typical rate I should be asking? hourly of daily?

2. Is there really a labour shortage, I see lots of job adverts but are these companies pulliing resumes so they can bid on projects or are there that many jobs available

3. Who paysfor travel as most of them seem to be GP or Ft Mac? Do you fly or drive?

4. how long are the typical rotations? 2-3wks

5. I would suspect the work is similar to being in a military field amb, lots of hurry up and wait, but no canvasor MRE's and little chance of an IED

6. is the pay normally a flat day rate or is it hourly then OT for more?

7. which are good comapanies to work for

thank you

[tniuqs]

Welcome to EMTCity .. where its likely there is more Canadians than Yalls these days .. a great place to chat as ACoP can not afford that venue for open communications ..

northernboy'

Hi gang,

I have been qualified as an EMT-P for a few yrs, prior to that I spent 3-yrs in the Military as a med tech but didn't do any special other than outpatient work/Fd amb (as in no combat tours).

Question is are you registered in AB or BC ? A huge flag should be be raised if any company hires non registered, that screams they have a piss poor rep with the established AB REMT-P.

I am looking at going to University full-time so I wanted to drop myself down to part time with the city and supplement that with industrial work.

Getting out of EMS are we ?

The old "Don't count your chickens until they hatch" or "don't throw the baby out with bath water" the should be seriously be applied this time of the year, see break up, freeze up and weather delays.

The question is when I look at the job offers many of them say to put forward my salary expectations. I have heard from people that the going rate is $600-800/day but this is usually from people when I push them on it they have never actually done any industrial work. I have taken a bunch of industrial day course stuff like H2S alive etc to hopefully make me more hireable.

They are phishing for a sucka .. the going standard rate is 6 a day for 24 hour, if they are offering less they are most likely FM or ISOS. Yeah H2S what a joke eh ? Get IRP 16 or PSA or CST .. All of industry demands this "H2S ticket" but FAIL to provide SCBA when you get to the bloody site. Short answer on day rate is yes and no, it depends for whom you are working. An alarming trend I have observed is a few bigger International Industrial shows are underbidding contracts and then want the Paramedics to take a paycut (called price fixing) some of these bigger shows just in passing, typically provide crap for gear. Although AB OH+S legislates this REMT-P level the companies can be damn cheap when it comes to kit or meds. With the over 240 Ma and Pa companies, best said its hit and miss.

Curiously enough this environment is THE areas that one requires the best of gear and the best of planning ad experiance (ps a STARS registered site assures nothing, its a false promise of hope in many cases WEATHER is the word) So do your local homework, even if their is an ERP on the wall check the contact numbers.

Because the so called "medic" that of 19 y/o blonde, redhead or brunette hired for "eye candy" as the first real call they get, is the first wreck they have ever seen. The EMR level that has gone before in Industry in AB (BC is way worse with the F.A. OFA level 3) So don't expect to be highly respected of :>( .... You are paid because of what you KNOW not what you DO, in a blue shirt culture of work where ones way up the ladder is based on "physical labour" your low man on the pole, well until "MAN DOWN" is screamed .

The Oil and Gas Industry company safety types (typically past EMRs or very low time as EMTs) are really not safety they are "liability watch dogs for the company" So if you have any "ethics" expect to be challenged with personal health information sharing and rights of workers, good luck, expect to be given ancillary duty's that were never mentioned in any interview. That's if your lucky enough to have an interview for expectations ... typically its here's your flight ticket or get to the "shop" the prime contractor needs you yesterday oh and good luck.

There are some excellent Paramedics in Industry that are attempting to improve scope of practice and provide real "primary care" like bug juice for that abscessed tooth, like suturing under clean conditions, good solid medical advice for ongoing care, bedside Troponin testing +++ but typically its short term cash, in get out.

Another HUGE Red Flag .. if requested by safety supervisor to do a "Post Incident DOA" (drugs of abuse urine test) where you have just taken a history or put on a band-aid " simply stated unless you have a extremely knowledgeable medical/legal human rights Lawyer retained by yourself, your walking a very fine line, best advice "state you have no training in this area" call a third party to do this.

Its ALL about TRI (total recordable incidents) prime contractor reporting of safety incidents and AB gov madated reporting on line, so expect some "sweeping under the rug stuff" You WILL be asked to put steri-strips on when buddy actually needs sutures (Medical Aid vs First Aid) in the check box. Most workers, because of zip for job security will not go to the "medic" because its a pack your bags and a one way ticket home.

Just one band-aid applied and expect a safety "spanish inquisition" most seriously I have recorded less with public service in a fatality than a "possible" repetitive injury strained wrist. That said: There is really very little government intervention (unless a fatality occurs) in any incident if their is even one silly complain you are history. Its called getting "skidded" and do not expect any of these EMS Industrial shows to cover you in anything legally their priority is THEIR COMPANY ONLY.

So I have a few questions for anyone who has actually worked up north not if your neighbours friends brothers have

1. What is the typical rate I should be asking? hourly of daily?

See above, if you go Industry in a city its pretty much the same as EMS for a hourly rate.

2. Is there really a labour shortage, I see lots of job adverts but are these companies pulliing resumes so they can bid on projects or are there that many jobs available.

LOL .. yes you have that correct again, Let me introduce the terms "Break up" "Freeze Up" and Weather delays.

3. Who pays for travel as most of them seem to be GP or Ft Mac? Do you fly or drive?

It depends ... insist on flying to FMM in winter or that HWY 63 will kill you, in passing a TRI FATALITY in FMM are higher than the sandbox, yes really, almost a fatal a week in winter.

http://safer63and881.com/pdfs/Safer63_881_SponsorPackage_NEW.pdf

http://www.safer63and881.com/press.html

The government is too GDamn cheap to put an real ALS station on those roads, and maybe a chopper ? sans the STARS PR flying blood clot monopoly, if you have a "registered site" close to these roads YOU with your MTC may be asked to respond just as the Conklin airstrip crash, with jack shit for back up. ps you will have no peads kit and lots of Rez around.

4. how long are the typical rotations? 2-3wks

Depends .. if you turn down one rotation the companies WILL find someone else, you get put to bottom of list, they again are all about bottom line costs, that said LOTS of semi-retired guys and there is about 50 core that do this and due too availability will make it very difficult for you with a schedule.

5. I would suspect the work is similar to being in a military field amb, lots of hurry up and wait, but no canvasor MRE's and little chance of an IED.

See HWY 63 an 881 links .. no MRE but some camps the food you will wish for one "lung in a bag" ;>).

6. is the pay normally a flat day rate or is it hourly then OT for more?

Depends again on the Companies contract but if you can have a contract "in place" with a delayed pay and tack on 19% per month .. yah know just in case the company forgets to pay you its not unheard of.

7. which are good comapanies to work for

It can be a crap shoot NO it is a crap shoot ..

thank you

Should I get into the very serious safety concerns of the MTC (a camper mounted on a 3/4 ton 4x4) with a very poor excuse for roll-over protection) and just what "buddy" will drive it if there is a wreck ? AB OH+S, AB Transport, ACoP or the PC ignore the risks to WE the providers.

Personal Advice:

Do NOT become complacent because when shit hits the fan you are essentially by yourself, kinda hard to work a code if you haven't thought it thought. Make written records of narc turn over and check the actually kits the typical (pick up some fast cash) REMT-P are under the impression that "nothing will happen" and that's just not the reality.

There is a move afoot to organize <gasp> because as you know from your CAF experience this remote provision of care is NOT typical EMS in Public sector. A new focus of really good shows is pairing OH+S RN with ACP (or ACP with additional education) for clinic and ALS response setting's.. but those are very rare bird's.

Oh and expect changes to legislation if those "ostrich head in the sand" " and "import foreign workers" Progressive Conservatives finally get the boot ...

Hope that helps .. contact PM if you need more intel.

[northernboy]

thanks guys,

thats helpul. registered in Al-berda, looking at U of C, allready have 1.5 yrs worth of credits as have been slowly plugging away on courses here and there. I figured $600/day was the more likely number, everyone who mentioned $800 had never done industrial work in the patch.

Yes, thinking of my options in the long term, fact is I really like working as a medic but I cannot stand night shfts, I have always struggled to stay awake past 11pm, was one of reasons why I left the forces, all that night fighting...

Even when i was 18 and in the military lots of the boys would be able to party all night, not me, frickin useless past 11pm. I can't see it getting better when I am 45 and still stuck doing long nights and flexing.

Was thinking of a couple options, university, or doing industrial contract work for a few weeks in, few weeks out but still doing oncall medic work in the city (days mostly) to keep skills up. That appeals to my lifestyle of mt biking in summer and boarding in winter

was looking into doing a chiro or physio degree so U of C for pre-req's as know a few people who do both and have used both for different problems and they seem very happy with their work. Not really intereted in medicine, most doctors I have met seem pretty grumpy and they often work horrible hours.

[Tactical Spork]

Best of luck. A lot of solid advice so far. Just expect firm answers from potential employers, and don't leave any details (travel costs, day rates, duration) out. Assuming something is the fastest way to get caught.

For example, I ran into a medic who was going out west to work. Somehow he seemed convinced that he didn't have to get registered in Alberta to do this, nor did he seem to believe me when this was pointed out. The company had a special 'deal' with ACoP to deal with this. LOL. He even paid for his flights out west, just to find out as you guessed, that he couldn't work. A week or so later he was back in town. The last I heard he was trying to do international work for free to 'break in.'

That is not the way to do it.

Needless to say, if you approach this line of work with a direct goal then you should be ok. Be it for academic reasons, to fund your endless summer, or whatever. Just keep in mind no money is free, so it might be ok now. You might not miss the night shifts, but long rotations in/out have their own unique issues.

Just keep asking around, and making those contacts. Soon enough you will get a feel for who is good, and who to stay away from. Personally, I deal with a few key companies that I have a relationship with. If I do consider trying something new, I am very critical of their operations. If I have any concerns I just walk away.

[tniuqs]

For example, I ran into a medic who was going out west to work. Somehow he seemed convinced that he didn't have to get registered in Alberta to do this, nor did he seem to believe me when this was pointed out. The company had a special 'deal' with ACoP to deal with this. LOL. He even paid for his flights out west, just to find out as you guessed, that he couldn't work. A week or so later he was back in town. The last I heard he was trying to do international work for free to 'break in.'

SALIENT POINT.

I just may have knowledge of whom that employeer(s) may be , actually their is a couple that hide behind a loophole that will be soon changed, when we eventually get accepted under HPA that 200 dollar fine will change markedly and may result in loss of Practice Permit in your own hood.

Thier are no "inspectors'" as of yet but rest assured if you doing something "under the radar" you will get balls busted one way or another.

[Tactical Spork]

I think one of the main issues is experience. Typically, from what I have seen, it is the new guy who gets in over their head, or gets burned. You know, the new guy who really, really, really wants to 'break in.' To the point that common sense is pushed to the wayside, and red flags are ignored.

That inexperience also plays out on the clinical side, also. I am not saying you need to be the trauma god to work in the industrial setting, but some level of experience is required. People working the patch right out of school, in my view, is wrong. It happens all the time, of course.

The way I see it, from my experience anyway, is once you gain experience you know what type of project work well for you. That fit within your ability, if you will. Also, with experience you know what type of income such a position will generate.

Now all you have to do is find such a job, for a company that won't farm out to newbies for a lower rate!

SALIENT POINT.

I just may have knowledge of whom that employeer(s) may be , actually their is a couple that hide behind a loophole that will be soon changed, when we eventually get accepted under HPA that 200 dollar fine will change markedly and may result in loss of Practice Permit in your own hood.

Thier are no "inspectors'" as of yet but rest assured if you doing something "under the radar" you will get balls busted one way or another.

[northernboy]

thanks gang, very insightful.

I have been an Alberta registered EMT-P for a few yrs fulltime in a city.

In the military I spent most of my time in an evac platoon tasked out to combat arms teams. Most of that work was in reality sprains/strians, general outpatient stuff, colds/flus, injections, dealing with soldiers rotten feet and the occasional suture and very very rarely serious trauma when it hit the fan as I never deployed overseas to the two way firing range. I worked part time (unoficially) as an EMT to get ambulance experience in my free time before growing my hair a bit longer and doing the EMT-P course.

Industrial sounds very similar to the military.

[Tatical Spork]

Yep, in many ways what you will be doing will be just like military work, but instead of, say providing medical coverage for some training exercise you will be providing coverage to workers. Where were you posted to during your time with the CF?

I don't know if you are done with the military, but Calgary has a reserve medical unit. Not sure if that is what you are looking for, but I figured I would mention it as cash is cash when you are a poor student.

[northernboy]

thanks guys, really helpful & much appreciated

I was in Pet and then Edmonton and of course here and there with training/exercises, never went to the sand box. Never did anything special, a bored medic is a good medic and all that...

I have been a long haired civvy EMT-p for a few yrs now in Cal-gree. Not really interested in the military anymore, was a positive experience but that scratch has been itched so to say.

I am sending off a resume to IPS as after a brief chat as they seem to have a lot of work on & a big outfit to get a bit of experience with. Will use up a long block of holiday time for a contract to try it out and see if its for me.

You guys have been great, thanks again