14 Day EMT B class

[EMT City Administrator]

This is not going to turn into an "EMTs are only as good as........" thread. If it does, it will be locked.

[VentMedic]

This is not going to turn into an "EMTs are only as good as........" thread. If it does, it will be locked.

Apologies. That is not my intent.

However, since EMS levels are listed as votech for an educational classification, another example I could use is an entry level carpentry training program that also requires 110 hours. They too could choose to finish the program in a few weeks or several months. Others at the union hall may say "It took you how long to do that?"

The point is: EMS education is still measured in "hours". Thus, liberties can be taken with how one can choose to obtain those hours and still say "I met the requirements".

[terr0154]

Hmm... I would not want a couple basics with 14 days of training evaluating me! *Referring to BLS unit. I don't know how they would even pass the test.

[spenac]

Hmm... I would not want a couple basics with 14 days of training evaluating me! *Referring to BLS unit. I don't know how they would even pass the test.

Sadly they get the same limited education as the 6 month course.

[WolfmanHarris]

I know you explained this at some point Vent, but how are credits measured in the states? In Canada (well Ontario) Universities measure as half credits (half year) or full credit (full year) or double/triple credits (usually reading courses or thesis courses). But all the colleges measure courses in terms of credit hours. So A&P 1 was a 60 credit unit course, which means the course had 60 hours of class time. So while I'm in a two year program, internally each course is counted in credit hours.

[Dustdevil]

Of coarse course I agree with you, I dont think they should be allowed on the ambulance at all, but if we are going to have "drivers", lets make sure they are qualified "drivers".

Probably the best two posts you've ever made here, dude! It actually puts it into a perspective that seems to be lost on most. If you are going to stick me with an EMT-B for a partner, then at least focus on qualifying him or her for what is indisputably the most critical function of his or her job. I don't need someone to help me take care of my patients. I am quite capable of doing that myself. What I need is someone to take care of ME! I can't teach you to drive from the back of the ambulance, and that is where I am going to be for about half of each shift.

An EMT partner has little to no potential for really making a difference in patient care. They are actually much more likely to take a life. But they can still save lives. And that needs to start with MY life. The way to do that is to assure from the beginning that they are professionally trained to drive the ambulance in a safe manner. The current variety of EVOC courses do not seem to do an adequate job of that. And the current EMT curriculum is wholly appropriate for non-driving first responders, but for an ambulance EMT, there is NO function more important than safe driving. I say that, for them, the curriculum should be 8 hours of CPR, 8 hours of standard first aid, and all the remaining hours spent on emergency vehicle operations.

[Designcafe]

This subject has come up before.. and the replies seem to all go the same direction. Anyone who took the Community College version of the EMT program thinks it cannot possibly be taught effectively in the 14 days. My local CC teaches it in 3 months for a total of 110 hours- plus the required 8 hours of ride time (clinical). On the other hand, anyone who took their EMT training thru their local FD says it can easily be taught in less than 14 days since they work much longer days. Unitek gives 160 hours of instruction, 12 hours of ride time and tons of simulations. Knowledge is tested daily and students can and do flunk out of the program.

Speaking from experience: I took the Unitek 14 day Bootcamp back in 2006 and i did a 12 hour ride along with King American in San Francisco. At the end of my 14 days of training-(each day in a classroom from 7am till 8pm and with 4 hours of hands on and 1 hour of testing each day) I then took the National Registry exams. Guess what? I pass with scores in the high 90's. After returning to my home state, I applied for reciprocity and took my state practicals and written exam- guess what? I passed with a 98%.

Since then I have taken the SOLO Wilderness EMT program and over 300 hours of other continuing education.

Bottom line- No one is fully prepared for every possible situation they could encounter with only 14 days (160 hours) of education in a field completely new to them. So, did 14 days prepare me for a career as an EMT?- it gave me the baseline of needed information and it made me feel confident enough to work with a partner who had more field time.

But just as a side note- my first ambulance company job (I worked for a different company FT for 1.5 years) paired me with 2 partners (different shifts)- 1 who had his CC trained state license for 12 months and knew nothing- no even how to palpate vitals. And the 2nd who has just completed her medic license 3 days before leaving the military and did not have our state license yet- She also knew no where near enough to pass our state exam. But hey, neither of them did their training in 14 days!

How well you know information and can take it and use it in the field has more to do with the person and how they learn/retain information than it does how many days it was given.

And since know one has noticed yet.. The former Director of Education for Unitek is the same man who started the Paramedic Bootcamp program in Iowa. He taught the EMT Bootcamp for 2 years before leaving to start his own company.

But i am sure this debate will continue....

[ninjaemtff]

So this may come as a shock, however I agree with Dust. I think that it should be 8 hrs of CPR 8 hrs of First aid, then the rest on vehicle operations.

I myself am only an EMT-B right now, but I believe that if you are going to be in this field you need to move forward. I think that the EMT-B and First responders are good for Firefighters and police, you know the true first responders. And of course the drivers who just want to play wit lights and sirens... In my area EMT-B is a big thing, and we have hot shots who think because they passed the EMT-B course that they know everything and can do everything. When really its advanced first aid. Hate to burst their bubbles.

I plan on moving forward in EMS, I eventually want to be a fire medic (yeah yeah I know wrong thing to say here.) But my point is, I'm going to move forward in EMS, I'm going to do whatever it takes to be the best I can be. I started out as a basic because I wont lie it started as a hobby for me, but knowing what I know now, it was stupid to ever think of it as a hobby. This is a profession, peoples lives are in our hands, and we need to be completely professional and well trained, and trained to the best standards. Being satisfied with being just a basic and trying to make a career out of it, is just foolish...

[Dustdevil]

Quality post, Designcafe. And I am inclined to agree with you. At the EMT-B level, I find no real problem with the accelerated approach. Especially since, as you point out, the amount of instruction and practice time given surpasses the national standard. It's not for everyone, by any means. But I do believe that it is a viable option for training at the basic level.

[VentMedic]

I know you explained this at some point Vent, but how are credits measured in the states? In Canada (well Ontario) Universities measure as half credits (half year) or full credit (full year) or double/triple credits (usually reading courses or thesis courses). But all the colleges measure courses in terms of credit hours. So A&P 1 was a 60 credit unit course, which means the course had 60 hours of class time. So while I'm in a two year program, internally each course is counted in credit hours.

I admit to knowing little to nothing about the Canadian system.

The U.S. college system:

Using the 16-week semester and the 50-minute class hour:

Lecture-

Normally, one credit hour is associated with a class meeting for 50 minutes per

week for an entire semester (or the equivalent 750 semester-minutes, excluding

final exams). Another widely repeated standard states that each in-class hour of

college work should require two hours of preparation or other outside work.

Laboratory –

Normally, one credit hour is associated with a class meeting for 50 to 200 minutes

per week for an entire semester (or the equivalent 750 to 3,000 semester-minutes,

excluding final exam, in other meeting formats). Two semester credit hours could

be earned for a class meeting for 150 to 300 minutes per week over the semester.

(The overlap in minutes in class allows for departmental discretion.)

Lab Prep –

One semester credit hour is associated with a class meeting 50 to 150 minutes per

week over the semester.

Clinic –

One semester credit hour is associated with a class meeting 100 to 300 minutes

per week over the semester.