EMS funeral's vs FD funeral's

[Doug]

Odd discussion at work the other day. We were talking about how when a FF dies, depending on final requests and circumstances, the FF's casket is often placed on the bed of a piece and driven to the final resting place. I chimed in with "Yeah, how come when an EMS provider dies, the same isn't done with an ambulance." To which I got the response "Because it's illegal, ambulances are not allowed to transport dead bodies." (the law actually allows for the transport of DB's in the case of a public health hazard, but that's besides the point.) I nodded and said "Yeah I know, but they would probably grant a waiver if someone asked." I was told that some families have tried in the past and been told no, and the law was cited as the reason. An ambulance is not a hearse etc.

Does this seem odd to anyone? I'm not trying to get a "They are FD biased!!" flame war going. Is this just in Massachusetts, has anyone ever seen this done? I have even heard of PD's doing it with SWAT/Tactical vans or "paddy wagons" kept in service for just such events. Seems odd that the only ones NOT allowed to use an unlicensed hearse is the one actually designed to carry a body.

[crotchitymedic1986]

Being against the law is news to me ---- its usually because many EMS agencies are private or not government based, and since we are a younger industry, we dont have the traditions that fire departments do. But i have seen EMS bodies transported via ambulance, with the long ambulance procession, reading of the "Last Call", and playing of amazing grace or other songs via bagpipes.

[JPINFV]

I highly doubt that there's any law that prohibits an off duty ambulance from transporting a deceased provider for memorial purposes any more than there being a law authorizing off duty fire engines from transporting dead bodies of fire suppression employees.

[Chief1C]

A couple years ago, one of our oldest, and most active members passed away. One of those guys that you don't realize how much their friendship meant, till they aren't there anymore. He was like everyone's grandfather.

I went on my first call with him; and I was on his last call. We don't talk about it, because when we start to share our memories, there isn't a dry eye in the room. It was probably the most highly attended funeral in twenty years. It was so difficult to remain composed, but we did an honor guard made up of our crew. He was very well respected, aside from being like a part of our families, it went so much farther than us; ER staff, doctors, other services, patients, hundreds of people.

A paid service from out of the area had read about it in the paper, and before the funeral, they showed up w/ a MICU and donated their time to cover our calls during the funeral.

We tried, but couldn't secure a hearse style ambulance for his funeral. So, we removed the cot mounting equipment, covered our light bars and draped the ambulance that he drove on his last call in black sashes and put his casket in the ambulance. Lining the ambulances up, myself an officer at the time, and the other two officers; and our guys best buddy, got in the back of the ambulance with him; and the rest of the crew in the second ambulance. We took him to the church, and onto the cemetery. I thought it was very fitting, and respectful to a man that had served actively for over 53 years.

[fireflymedic]

all the EMS funerals I have attended that were solely EMS and not fire based or where the person was also a FF involved an ambulance transporting the casket. Most have had FD in attendance as well as some PD with a last call given and a ladder pass through out of respect that they were also public safety. The same applies to PD at least in this area. I can't speak for other areas, but thats how it works here.

[Doug]

Under 105 CMR 170.260, ambulances are generally prohibited from transporting a dead body, except "...where it is in the interest of public health and/or safety to do so."

[Doug]

(239 CMR 3.10) also prohibits any vehicle, other than a certified hearse, from moving a dead body.

[WolfmanHarris]

Does it count if it's not in service?

When Paramedic and Firefighter (not in the same job) Steve Van Hemme died I was at the funeral. Both his engine and an ambulance from the service were in the procession, but the casket was in the hearse.

[JPINFV]

(239 CMR 3.10) also prohibits any vehicle, other than a certified hearse, from moving a dead body.

So then Boston Fire broke the law (when doesn't Boston FD break the law?) when they gave the funerals for Cahill and Payne last year? Alternatively, does Boston FD have an old apparatus that they dedicate to funerals?

[WolfmanHarris]

Or the White House when Reagan's body was transported by caisson?

I think quoting chapter and verse on laws on this one won't get us any closer the root of this question as much as realizing that as the bastard child of Healthcare and Public Safety, sometimes spending our time living with Uncle FD or other with cousin Private service, the odd time Grandma and Grandpa Hospital and sometimes being emancipated and living on our own in a one bedroom apartment, living Third Service we have no real tradition. (By the way the metaphor were not meant to pass judgment on service models; just be entertaining)

Talking to a professor who is also the President of the Ontario Paramedic Association following the Van Hemme funeral she commented that EMS is Canada has had to figure out on the fly how we do funerals. She compared the funeral she attended in BC for the two BCAS medics who died in the mine, to the one she attended for the Catham-Kent medic and then to Steve's and said we've had to quickly decide how we want to represent ourselves at these things.

Whether it be the road lined with an honour guard at attention of Paramedics, Firefighters, Police, Dispatch and all the other uniformed service members in attendance, to the Ambulance draped in black cloth over the lights and the front, to the Toronto EMS Honour Guard (or Alberta or Manitoba as they case may be), to the Class A uniforms that were brought out for all the management types, the ties on all the regular medic's uniforms and the arm-bands with the medic number (or OASIS number) on them. We will build traditions the hard way. A medic will die and we will look to honour their service. We'll look at what was done before and copy it. The unfortunate thing is, we're building experience in this way too fast.

Be safe. I don't want to attend another service funeral before I get out of school.

- Matt